Idk, here they are pirating stuff a the expenses of a single modder from what I gather. And just to sava 5 usd? Really? A soft drink costs more and it’s probably unhealthy. There’s work behind these things, that ain’t free, you get it? I get it it’s a patreon, but what are they supposed to do if they aim to make a living on that?
I see. Well there’s not way you could know this if you’re out of the loop. Anyway, if you’re not fine with the price tag just don’t buy it and don’t use it. No need to pirate this, it’s not a life saving tool
How to say you know nothing about game development without saying you know nothing about game (software) development. But want to assert your opinion on it regardless.
It’s corporate profiteering not lazy devs. The devs work their asses off, these aren’t their decisions to make.
It’s like blaming the guy finishing the drywall for design problems with the building. Lazy drywallers, ruining a good office tower, it wouldn’t be leaning if they weren’t so lazy.
The more people defend the lazy game devs, the more crappy half finished games we will get. The reason people need to seek out upscaling at all for Starfield is because the game isn’t optimized. Lazy design.
PureDark, who claimed to make more than $40,000 per month from locking DLSS3 mods behind their Patreon page,
Make that 50k, his current patreon page shows over 10k members. There’s stuff for several games there, tho, like RDR2, Last of Us 2, Elden Ring, Fallout 4, etc.
Seems there’s plenty of space for competitors to enter the “offer DLSS mods for games that don’t have it”
If I was earning that much per month, I wouldn’t worry about taking extra time to add DRM to my stuff. Despite the cracked version floating around, he got more subscribers since the first stories came around and he’s at zero risk of suffering any significant loss. Pirate that shit with a clean conscience
For sure, but like most every other mod for any game out there, there’s donation pages and Patreons. What if you buy it and download it, and it turns out it doesn’t work for you? You can’t refund it like you would a Steam game. Locking mods, an already experimental thing, behind a paywall is scummy, because you’re not only profiting off of someone else’s game, you’re also taking money from people who aren’t even sure it’s right for them. There are tons of mods out there that are not paywalled and are comfortably financially supported through Patreon. Using a paywall in this situation is just a cash grab banking on a freshly released game. Literally the day after.
So don’t get it? There are other mods and whatnot. Just sounds like you don’t like how they’ve monetised their work, which is fine, but instead of moaning that you want people to work for free, just don’t buy it?
Way to strawman me and ignore my points 👍 I do not want people working for free. I am firmly pro-union and pro-fair pay and all of that. They don’t have to work for free. They can monetize it the way every other mod does it by having a Patreon that you can subscribe to or donate to support them. Plenty of mods do this already and this is the generally accepted way to do it due to the reasons I mentioned before, which I will now spell out for you because you ignored them:
If you have a problem with the mod, it doesn’t work how you want, you have no recourse if you paywall it the way they did.
It is generally unethical and a bad look to make money using other’s IP as a base without their permission. Bethesda has potential legal recourse for this, as they’ve broken EULA. Section 3 - B, D, G, and 4. Section 4 is especially interesting because it states you agree to not have a monetary interest in the game or its content. By paywalling a mod, you are relying on the game not having DLSS to make money. Full stop. That’s the point of the mod. While the various paragraphs in Section 3 do say that modding of any kind is prohibited, this kind of thing is usually not enforced (as is very apparent with Skyrim or Fallout 4). Until money is involved. This is why a donation button is distanced far enough away from this kind of thing. A donation button is supporting the developer, and legal waters get a little grayer. For this mod, you are paying for the mod. That’s pretty black and white, and that’s exactly why it is frowned upon to go that route with mods.
Yeah, I was going to give the example of a GPU - something you might buy to play this game. But pretty much everything that goes into the setup and desk that lets you play the video game kinda counts.
The difference is the legal boundary. Microsoft allows you legally to write your own code and sell it to people to run on their computers without owning Microsoft as a company. Bethesda owns their software, and has legal agreements you agree to when you skip through them when you start up the game, saying you won’t mod it or profit off their game. Look at my other comment if you want to actually see where.
Once again, you didn’t read my comment lmao. You’re right. They do ignore it, but they don’t ignore it when money is involved. Literally look up cases where companies shut down mods, they usually are financially driven.
Since you’re not here to actually have a discussion in good faith, I’m going to go. Take care 👋
Maybe I misunderstood them but the Digital Foundry guys were just making this point in regards to FSR 3, which is also a frame generation technology. They were saying that you also need to implement FSR 2, as the upscale techniques were used to drive the frame generation. Might not be the same for the Nvidia side of things.
The inputs are mostly the same, so implementing one essentially implements the other. Much like how implementing fsr2 is so similar to dlss and xess. (Which is why these mods came out in a matter of hours after early release)
DF was referring to a question about devs patching old games to add in fsr3 frame gen, as if its some simple toggle for games which may not even have motion vector or optical flow data already exposed.
Thats more due to Nvidia making both Frame Generation, Upscaling and the original use, Anti Aliasing (the SS in DLSS is super sampling) the same term.
Realistically, DLSS should be referred to as an anti aliasing technique(like TAA is) but it was basically colloquially hijacked to turn into an upscaling tech.
Thats more due to Nvidia making both Frame Generation, Upscaling and the original use, Anti Aliasing (the SS in DLSS is super sampling) the same term.
Realistically, DLSS should be referred to as an anti aliasing technique(like TAA is) but it was basically colloquially hijacked to turn into an upscaling tech.
It’s a 1 time $5 fee. People are just mad that they’re broke after buying a 4090. Frustrations should be aimed at Nvidia, not this one dude trying to make a buck
I don’t have a problem with some mods being sold. My issue is when you price it initially for free and THEN decide later to charge money for it. That’s within your rights of course, but don’t expect people to not get pissed off enough to pirate it.
Sure modders can put stuff behind paywalls, but implementing DRM, is overkill. And it would be nice if they release month old versions for free afterwards… sSo I have to see, Starfield isn’t that old yet.
BTW, I am not really getting the FSR/DLSS situation.
Shouldn’t FSR2 be working on Nvidia gpus as well and is open source? DLSS is propritary and only works on Nvidia.
So I am not really understanding the issue here, other than customers of Nvidia not having FSR2 because Nvidia hasn’t implemented the open standard, right? So they should complain to them about it.
IMO this is a bit like the fediverse vs. other social media topic, so I would complain about people creating their own propritary stuff, that is intentionally incompatible with the fediverse, and not about people that use the fediverse API in their app, but not support some propritary API.
I think the mod is simply a better implementation of DLSS and one that possibly even works on non-nvidia or non-dlss supported GPUs. IDK, I saw it the other day on Nexus but didn’t get it because FSR works just fine 🤷🏻♂️
Most people think DLSS is a better upscaler than FSR so that’s why people wanted DLSS support, but it only works on Nvidia RTX GPUs, while FSR will work on both Nvidia and AMD GPUs. Downside is FSR apparently isn’t as good as DLSS but I can’t confirm that as I have an AMD GPU.
My GPU is Nvidia (1660 Super), but doesn’t support DLSS or doesn’t support the latest iteration of it, I am not entirely sure. I, personally, try to avoid using upscalers and just want the native resolution. This is the only game I have taken advantage of the upscaling for more than just comparison, because it’s almost unplayable without it since the GPU I have is technically below the minimum requirement. My sister has a newer RTX card so I can compare DLSS between FSR, and I can’t even really tell much difference. They’re both blurrier than native, but it’s more noticable on a monitor than a TV.
Yeah anything with a GTX prefix like your 1660S doesn’t support DLSS, only the RTX 2000 and up works. I agree completely, I’ve never used upscaling before as I’d much rather have a clearer picture at native resolution, but if I wanna stay above 30FPS minimums then I need to use FSR with my RX 6700XT running at 1440p. Didn’t think I’d play any games that made my GPU feel that bad for at least another year or two.
Just to clarify for everyone, only this clown’s DLSS 3 mod (3 as in frame generation) is paywalld. His dlss 2 mod (2 as in normal dlss) is free on nexus.
Also to all the mental gymnasts trying to justify this horse shit, remember, the patreon sub is $5/MONTH. This means if you buy 1 month at $5 to download the mod, and the author “conveniently” comes out with an update one month later, you need to subscibe for another $5. So basically it’s a fucking subscription for a god damn dlss 3 mod. You know the author is milking this bullshit to keep subscibers and keep his income flowing. Marty mcfly does the same fucking dogshit with his stupid ass RTGI reshade shaders. Fuck that shit. Those people can go get fucked.
Personally I find it hard to care as I won’t be playing the game for longer then a month anyhow. That said, real easy to wait for someone else to drop a dlss3 mod or just go without.
The DLSS3 mod runs via ReShade. I don’t mind people charging for their work, but this guy is selling access to an Nvidia dll via an open source tool, which I am not a fan of. Not a lot of original work, just repackaging.
It’s great if you have a decent framerate to start with, but it really struggles at lower framerates and you’ll get a lot of ugly artifacts if there’s any rapid movement on screen.
There’s basically zero disadvantage to turning on DLSS 2. Most of the time you cannot or can barely tell the difference.
DLSS 3 introduces lots of artifacting, some frames straight up look like DALL-E image, it adds input lag, and it needs you to already have a high framerate to start with to make it bearable, text in particular gets mangled by it.
Fast paced games and games that rely on quick reactions are a no-go for DLSS 3. It’s suitable for games like MS flight sim where adding input lag doesn’t really matter and there’s not rapid movement.
Knock it off with the fake news. My TV artifacts more than my 4090 when converting 24Hz films to 60/120. You can’t even notice any artifacting in DLSS 3 without taking screenshots and pixel-peeping. Quit talking out of your ass. DLSS 3 FG works amazingly well in Starfield.
I got it on PS5 (co-op) and in the space of 2 hours had randomly silent cutscenes, an invisible character in one, and my PSN Name and a mute icon permanently stuck the top left of the screen where all the information about rolls and characters liking or disliking things should appear.
Didn’t get any tutorials either, which is apparently a thing. So we’re just randomly pressing things and hoping it doesn’t fuck up the story for later.
The game rules here are actually very different. I play a ton of 5e D&D and it’s close enough to be useful but different enough to trip me up. S great example I just found out last night after over 80 hours of play as a Paladin: the smite spells last 10 turns and apply to each attack. In 5e the smite spells only affect one attack and are usually worse than divine smite (which isn’t a spell be uses a spell slot) because divine smite you decide to use when you hit so it never wastes a spell slot while the others can miss.
I would copy it but the fucking D&D Beyond app prevents copying. The smite spells in 5e say “on the next hit” basically. A lot of spells in BG3 have simplified descriptions and it’s hard to know when it is different language or a different effect.
Inventory is clunky as fuck. When I Ctrl click multiple items and pick up and add to wares nearly 100% of the time it fails on the first and I have to do it a second time. Dragging items to other characters when inventories are filtered will actually swap with the item that would be in that slot of their pack without the filter rather than the one showing. Opening containers (especially the ones that need an item inserted like puzzles) get covered by the main inventory and I have to drag them over. Everything with moving items around just feels slow as hell in general. I can’t manage characters’ inventory unless they’re in the party so I have to go through the dialogue to kick someone out then let someone join which isn’t all that long but can add up when they’re on opposite sides of camp and you realize you forgot something. The search is nice but why not let us search camp inventory too, that’s where most of my crap is. Items in containers in your inventory can help with clutter but they aren’t added to the hot bar automatically.
Last night I had two enemies spasm out of existence. One of them was so glitched that the game crashed when I killed them. I’ve had multiple enemies just sit as round for nearly ten seconds or more trying to decide what to do before they do it sometimes even at the end of their turn. When dealing with elevation in battles it is absolutely awful to try and target shit above you, there’s no way to have the camera “move up a floor”, you can sort of get around this by selecting an enemy on that floor but it’s tricky. Trying to do anything precise in combat is a pain. There’s no easy way to get you character to jump the maximum distance without moving first for example. Also it’s an annoying choice to make jumping take movement like 5e but also take a bonus action like D&D One, it should be one or the other, not both. There’s no easy way to save 10 ft of movement at the end, you’ll move 20 ft only to realize you have 9.9 ft of movement left and don’t have 10 ft for the jump.
There’s no way to demo what a dye will look like before using it. There’s no way to know if an item it’s dyed and with what. There’s no way to add wares to the barter screen (which is what the name wares seems to imply to me), only on the trade screen.
I’ve had a few dialogues that were confusing and seemed to rely on events that didn’t happen. Astarion told me he was a vampire then later but me but still acted like it was a big reveal moment. When clearing out the Githyanki creche multiple characters said something about how it’s a good thing we didn’t nuke them or something? That was never an option I saw. No idea what they’re talking about.
Characters will willfully walk into things that damage them including spotted traps and AOE spells from the battle they were in rather than walk around them. This is not in turn based mode, this is real time. When in real time why not just walk around it rather than mindlessly walk towards the player? Even if you want to blame me for the traps saying I should be in turn based mode (which is silly because they know the trap is there, it is spotted) when a battle ends with an AOE damage effect still on the field they automatically enter turn based mode and walk to me through it and take damage.
I’ve had times where I told them to walk somewhere only for the game to say I can’t get there so I have to figure out a tricky jump. Then everyone will walk around some nearby path and get to me without doing a jump at all.
Lit areas around characters die to weapons or spells do not show up with the clear outline that stationary lights have when in stealth mode.
This is all shit just off the top of my head. I’m fully aware a lot of it is minor. I’m fully aware a lot of it can be somewhat avoided or dealt with. It just frustrates me to no end to see people defending this game as if their baby is being attacked. Here’s the thing: I love this game! I’ve been enjoying it a lot! But that doesn’t mean it doesn’t have bugs. It doesn’t mean it is above criticism. A game can be a great game and still have flaws. It just irks me to no end to see how so many of the reviews of the game call it polished when it’s just not. Especially when the context of a lot of the reviews are spinning a narrative that this game should set a new standard that triple A studios have failed to meet. This feels like every Bethesda game (pre Fallout 76) did on launch: a ton of promise and a lot of fun but very rough around the edges. And I don’t appreciate it when fans of the game mock and victim blame me for problems in the game.
Not OP, and I’ve been loving the game, but it does have some jank. Pretty early in act 1 I came across a bugged quest which I couldn’t complete. Couple the occasional bugs with my inexperience never playing a game like this before and a somewhat unintuitive interface/help system, and it made for a pretty clunky onboarding experience. Now that I’ve more got the hang of things it feels better. But I needed to look for help outside of the game to really get a handle on it.
I’ve never finded bugs (Just the horny npcs One) that’s probably me being lucky. I do agree that without knowledge of a tabletop gdr or at least of other Classic RPG it’s pretty hard do get inside the mechanics. A Better tutorial Is probabily needed but still you can inspect every Word using “T” on the keyboard and read the rules
Yeah, once I figured out how the inspect menu worked, I started learning much faster. I feel a little dumb regarding that. When I first tried it, I just saw that it made the tooltip stick on the screen, I didn’t realize I could hover over the text for more information. So I just went “huh, that’s dumb” and barely used it again until I saw someone online do it lol.
And for what it’s worth, other than the quest bug, the rest of it is mostly just me feeling out the game, which I’m fine with and had fun with, just did a lot of save scumming. I’ve played MMOs so the interfaces and whatnot aren’t completely unfamiliar, but before this game I was only vaguely aware of how tabletop RPGs work
To be fair to Starfield, if you’re playing on the recommended hardware it runs incredibly well. I’m running a 7900xt and a Ryzen 7600X and the lowest fps I have with everything on ultra at 1440p is 80, don’t need any mods.
Edit: also Diablo 4 sucks because they turned it into another MMO with a battlepass that nobody wanted.
Diablo 4 technically flawless? The game barely works to this day. Just check the patch notes of how many abilities weren’t working. It’s still awesome but lol
Ghost of Tsushima: narrative masterpiece, evokes the sensibilities of a time and place, despite (very) infrequent frame stuttering–particularly if there are large crowds. F-
Does this type of mod break with updates, or could you potentially just stay on the version you downloaded and forego any updates? I don’t mod much to the point where I’ve paid for any, but curious the requisite of ongoing subscription for this type of thing.
That’s a good question. I’m not sure but I’d assume it would break with updates. I was thinking more about just updates the author makes to make the mod better. Likely he’ll keep working on making it better but you can bet your booty thay he’ll keep making minor updates once a month to milk his subsciber’s money. Patreon is a fucking scam.
Okay but Martys RTGI is great and works in quite alot of games without much tinkering (just need to access depth buffer), don’t mind paying for it. Useally sub and let it expire once every few years.
“I don’t mind buying my own painting and then paying monthly for it to have some details filled in that eventually get painted over anyway at some rate”
Is it morally wrong to have someone spy on the detail painter and copy their techniques? (In this metaphor techniques are DLSS implementation, not the paint (DLSS itself))
Out of this whole thing, I just want to say something about this.
Some players’ reactions to the paywall have been unfavorable; they think that charging for mods is unethical and goes against the spirit of community modification
Everyone needs to make bread. Someone asking for money from their mod or map or whatever isn’t against any spirit. It’s just a human being asking to make bread. Now some don’t agree with the price tag and that’s fine.
But we all need to recognize humans asking for some dough for their hard work is in the spirit of existing. Some folk do it for free just for the feelings and we love ‘em for it. But those asking for some cash are no different.
This world is already full of dog eat dog. Let’s not hate on someone just trying to get through it. You don’t have to pay the ask, but let’s not go making enemies just cause we don’t agree on that number on the price tag.
You don’t go into modding for the money. It’s like making a non profit for the money. That’s why they’re getting backlash, they’re asking money where money’s not supposed to be involved.
God forbid we pay for a fucking cup of coffee because that person should want to work for free. This is the same bullshit as “work hard play hard” and “we are family here”. Might as well start telling modders it’s not about the pay, it’s the people and experience we’re paying you in. Rent what’s that?
You are all on a lemmy instance after 2 months of non stop bitching about non paid reddit moderators. Make up your damn mind.
Yes, again you don’t mod for the money. If you’re looking for that, you can create your own software. Other people in this thread made other good points, and this guy was trying to make a dlss mod subscription based, so fuck that guy. It’s literally better if the mod doesn’t exist in that case. Like I said with my analogy, it’s like trying to create a non-profit for the profit. There’s a million other avenues available to them if they want money. Especially because they are basing their work off of other’s work whom are not getting paid, yet they are?
Also idk what you’re talking about with the mod stuff but I do think it’s dumb internet janitors do work for free lol, and they do it for power. I don’t think they should be paid either.
For real. You want it for free? Cool go ahead and make the mod yourself. All the tools are there. Wait, you don’t want to spend your time learning to code? You don’t want to spend your time learning modding tools. Our time is our most finite resource and you get mad when someone asks for something in return for theirs? People are just up their own asses.
The reason why he charges does not matter at all. Anyone wanting a service for free is not in the position to demand anything. Would it be nice to get stuff for free? Sure! But demanding free service and badmouthing if you don’t get it? Fuck off.
Wtf are you talking about, Skyrim has dozens of amazing quest mods, and hundreds of quest mods overall.
It has major gameplay overhauls, it has custom skeletons for animation, it literally has mods that rework the animation system entirely. Modders added a survival system almost a full decade before Bethesda did.
There are mods that add new continents ffs, what’re you talking about? One of the quest mods was so good it literally got turned into its own game.
Edit: There are currently 60k mods for Skyrim Special Edition, and about 70k for the original Skyrim. Meanwhile Morrowind has 11k. Wtf are you talking about??
The Forgotten City has “overwhelmingly positive” reviews on Steam with many people praising it for its Bethesda-like systems, so I’m not sure what you mean. Maybe you felt it wasn’t enough like Skyrim and disliked it for that, but clearly you don’t speak for others.
Also, no other Skyrim quest mod, out of the near 2 thousand quest mods for the game, had a full game built off of them. So while that does happen sometimes (ie Dayz), it’s exceedingly rare and far from some sort of “tradition” as you put it. If anything that was far more common a decade or two ago than it is now. The original Star Wars Battlefront mod was quite a long time ago after all.
And no I’m not mad, I’m just confused as to how you could think Skyrim has only bug fixes, UI, and graphics mods, when in reality it has nearly 7x the amount of mods that Morrowind has and is the primary example of a thriving modding scene. Idk if you just spouted that out without knowing, or what.
This is pretty long response lol so I’ll tackle each point individually.
Plenty of niche games have “overwhelmingly positive” reviews on…
Your whole argument on niche games getting good reviews, I actually fully agree with. The problem is that those reviews are literally the only metric we have to discern whether or not the people that played it enjoyed it - anything else is pure speculation. Including your point about people not liking it if they felt it didn’t feel enough like Skyrim, or people saying they like it just to appease others. It’s frankly bizarre that you’d make an argument for Steam Reviews not 100% showing the accuracy of people’s opinions, while simultaneously making statements like those with zero anything to back them up.
At the very least the reviews tell us that people who played it say they liked it. That’s just a fact. And considering that that’s all we have, I think it’s fair to use it. Anything else, again, is just pure speculation.
I know it can be hard to keep reading after you see something that MAKES YOU SO ANGRY but you should try.
This was weird lol.
“7x the amount of mods that Morrowind has”. First, that ignores how many quests and mods were lost to time.
No, it doesn’t. Skyrim has over 70k mods while Morrowind has roughly 11k. Even if there were over one hundred missing quest mods for Morrowind, which I doubt, it still wouldn’t affect that massive difference.
But also? of course it has more mods. The same way that basically every new game in a franchise SHOULD sell more than the previous one did. The audience for gaming has exploded over the decades.
This… just isn’t how modding works. Most new games releasing will have some reshades and a trainer, max. Once in a great while you’ll get some nudity. The size of the audience doesn’t change that - most games releasing simply don’t garner much mod support.
By your logic a game like Call of Duty should have a massive modding scene, as the new entry will be newer and have a massive audience, an audience multiple times bigger than any Bethesda game. But no, that’s just not how that works. Hell, even a game like The Witcher 3 only has half the number of mods that Morrowind does.
Also I’m confused as to the point of those links. Are you arguing that gaming has… gotten more popular over the years? Yeah no shit. As I said earlier, numbers going up doesn’t magically guarantee a thriving modding scene.
So if we assume roughly the same market share were playing TES games in both eras (and it is pretty safe to say that Skyrim is a MUCH more mainstream game than Morrowind was…), we would expect at least a 3.5x increase in the amount of mods.
As I went over before, no. Lol absolutely not. I don’t believe that you actually think this could possibly be true. Lets apply your logic to other mainstream games releasing nowadays and see if that logic holds water (hint, it doesn’t).
I am not disagreeing with the premise that it’s fair for someone to be paid for their work. However, during the Skyrim paid mod controversy (on Steam), I learned that there a lot of situations where having paid mods did hurt the modding community and created ethical concerns.
Mods were being stolen and sold by people that were not the actual mod authors.
Mods were being sold that depended on larger, more complicated mods to function, but the payment was not shared with the larger mod.
Mods that had multiple contributors were being sold by an individual who was not sharing the money with the other contributors.
Players were concerned about being asked to pay for bug fix mods when the developer should be fixing their own game. This is of course, was not the modders fault and does not mean their bug fix mod wasn’t valuable or deserving of pay, but many felt the developer should pay for it, not users.
I would also point out that it wasn’t just greedy players that complained about paid mods - a lot of modders thought it went against the spirit of modding because of how it harmed collaboration in the community. Suddenly, they couldn’t trust that others would not steal their work or profit from it unfairly. And, that seems like a reasonable take to me, given all the abuses that modders claimed happened in the short time that paid modding was a thing for Skyrim on Steam.
It feels like the issue is that it was offering the convenience of payment to mods, but not really thinking about the necessary friction of assuring licenses/legality/etc. All of that CAN, of course, be an issue for cheap Unity games too. I remember back when Steam Greenlight started, they required each game to donate $100 to charity to even be considered, basically placing a bet of assurance that it wasn’t a stolen asset flip (I don’t know if they still do that).
I think you’re exactly right - it is the combination of money + little oversight that is the big problem. Warframe seems to do a good job with tennogen but they limit it to only cosmetic mods and seem to be pretty restrictive about what they accept into their store. I don’t see how you could have good oversight for a game with as many mods as something like Skyrim has.
It’s not “oversight”, but if a modder needs to create their own storefront and Paypal integration, and advertising through word of mouth and their own social contacts (as in this case it seems), then that’s going to offer a lot more scrutiny than a low-effort asset flipper presenting themselves anonymously through Steam’s given storefront.
The game has just launched and the mod had been released and cracked already. This isn’t about making bread, it’s clearly a trivial hack for him to do, not something that requires full time job maintenence.
People spend hundreds of hours modding free of charge, what he does is a joke in comparison if we are talking about lost time that could have been spent earning money. The groundwork was made by Bethesda, AMD and Nvidia.
Remember, the patreon sub is $5/MONTH. This means if you buy 1 month at $5 to download the mod, and the author “conveniently” comes out with an update one month later, you need to subscibe for another $5. So basically it’s a fucking subscription for a god damn dlss 3 mod. You know the author is milking this bullshit to keep subscibers and keep his income flowing. Marty mcfly does the same fucking dogshit with his stupid ass RTGI reshade shaders. Fuck that shit. Those people can go get fucked.
If you want to charge $5 or $10 for your time spent making the mod, fine, whatever. But if you are trying to make it a subscription model then I have ZERO sympathy for you.
Ultimately, the guy is being upfront with his pricing and what he’s asking for. What’s the reason to hate on him? Either it’s worth it at that price or it’s not.
So you’re invalidating the feeling of being upset when something that used to be free (modding games) is no longer free. Modding has always been a free hobby that was run by good-willed pc gamers. Now monetization is fragmenting and ruining the modding experience.
You’re also justifying paying a subsciption on top of a fucking $70 game. Do you rip up a $5 bill every time you take a shit? Try it out. You may enjoy it.
No, I’d just choose not to use it and move on. Or if I’m broke and really wanted it, sure, pirate it. Not act like an entitled brat and whine and moan and it
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Idk, here they are pirating stuff a the expenses of a single modder from what I gather. And just to sava 5 usd? Really? A soft drink costs more and it’s probably unhealthy. There’s work behind these things, that ain’t free, you get it? I get it it’s a patreon, but what are they supposed to do if they aim to make a living on that?
Apparently they have a history of upping the price with every mod-breaking game update.
I see. Well there’s not way you could know this if you’re out of the loop. Anyway, if you’re not fine with the price tag just don’t buy it and don’t use it. No need to pirate this, it’s not a life saving tool
Lazy game devs should release finished optimized products.
How to say you know nothing about game development without saying you know nothing about game (software) development. But want to assert your opinion on it regardless.
It’s corporate profiteering not lazy devs. The devs work their asses off, these aren’t their decisions to make.
It’s like blaming the guy finishing the drywall for design problems with the building. Lazy drywallers, ruining a good office tower, it wouldn’t be leaning if they weren’t so lazy.
The more people defend the lazy game devs, the more crappy half finished games we will get. The reason people need to seek out upscaling at all for Starfield is because the game isn’t optimized. Lazy design.
I like that you are so unwilling to learn that you associate an explanation of a field you know nothing about as “defending”
😂😂
Or bad resource allocation by the management. If they cut performance development in favour of marketing what a developer can do?
Make that 50k, his current patreon page shows over 10k members. There’s stuff for several games there, tho, like RDR2, Last of Us 2, Elden Ring, Fallout 4, etc.
Seems there’s plenty of space for competitors to enter the “offer DLSS mods for games that don’t have it”
If I was earning that much per month, I wouldn’t worry about taking extra time to add DRM to my stuff. Despite the cracked version floating around, he got more subscribers since the first stories came around and he’s at zero risk of suffering any significant loss. Pirate that shit with a clean conscience
Piracy is always ethical
So the mod creator deserves nothing for their time and work?
The year is 2023. Gamers are expected to pay for the ability to utilize a feature built into their videocard. A true dystopia.
I mean won’t they just not provide the mod next time? Or stop supporting it? How is this good?
Man, and I was just about to get that mod too. Really scummy.
No, it’s always been behind a paywall. There’s one by a different modder that isn’t: https://www.nexusmods.com/starfield/mods/761
How has anyone’s experience been with this? I haven’t installed it yet.
Tried it last night. At first it wouldn’t start and had to change a digit from 0 to 1 or vice versa in the .ini, but worked fine after that.
Nice!
Is it? Didn’t someone put effort into this?
For sure, but like most every other mod for any game out there, there’s donation pages and Patreons. What if you buy it and download it, and it turns out it doesn’t work for you? You can’t refund it like you would a Steam game. Locking mods, an already experimental thing, behind a paywall is scummy, because you’re not only profiting off of someone else’s game, you’re also taking money from people who aren’t even sure it’s right for them. There are tons of mods out there that are not paywalled and are comfortably financially supported through Patreon. Using a paywall in this situation is just a cash grab banking on a freshly released game. Literally the day after.
So don’t get it? There are other mods and whatnot. Just sounds like you don’t like how they’ve monetised their work, which is fine, but instead of moaning that you want people to work for free, just don’t buy it?
Way to strawman me and ignore my points 👍 I do not want people working for free. I am firmly pro-union and pro-fair pay and all of that. They don’t have to work for free. They can monetize it the way every other mod does it by having a Patreon that you can subscribe to or donate to support them. Plenty of mods do this already and this is the generally accepted way to do it due to the reasons I mentioned before, which I will now spell out for you because you ignored them:
Because they didn’t monetise it the way you want, doesn’t mean it’s not okay.
Ignoring all of my comment again. Classic. See ya.
No, I’m just not looking for an essay, I’m responding to what I am interested in.
Way to invalid that person’s feelings.
No.
Can you link to a few game modders who don’t paywall but get enough in donations to make a living?
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Yeah, I was going to give the example of a GPU - something you might buy to play this game. But pretty much everything that goes into the setup and desk that lets you play the video game kinda counts.
The difference is the legal boundary. Microsoft allows you legally to write your own code and sell it to people to run on their computers without owning Microsoft as a company. Bethesda owns their software, and has legal agreements you agree to when you skip through them when you start up the game, saying you won’t mod it or profit off their game. Look at my other comment if you want to actually see where.
“you won’t mod it” this, as you know, is something people have done for decades and ignored.
Once again, you didn’t read my comment lmao. You’re right. They do ignore it, but they don’t ignore it when money is involved. Literally look up cases where companies shut down mods, they usually are financially driven.
Since you’re not here to actually have a discussion in good faith, I’m going to go. Take care 👋
I read all your comments. Classic way to leave when someone doesn’t agree with you. Ta ta.
Gotta love errors in tech articles.
Pardon my ignorance, but what’s the error?
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Isn’t frame generation dependent on upscaling?
Maybe I misunderstood them but the Digital Foundry guys were just making this point in regards to FSR 3, which is also a frame generation technology. They were saying that you also need to implement FSR 2, as the upscale techniques were used to drive the frame generation. Might not be the same for the Nvidia side of things.
The inputs are mostly the same, so implementing one essentially implements the other. Much like how implementing fsr2 is so similar to dlss and xess. (Which is why these mods came out in a matter of hours after early release)
DF was referring to a question about devs patching old games to add in fsr3 frame gen, as if its some simple toggle for games which may not even have motion vector or optical flow data already exposed.
Blame Nvidia for their purposefully misleading marketing.
Thats more due to Nvidia making both Frame Generation, Upscaling and the original use, Anti Aliasing (the SS in DLSS is super sampling) the same term.
Realistically, DLSS should be referred to as an anti aliasing technique(like TAA is) but it was basically colloquially hijacked to turn into an upscaling tech.
Nvidia already brands the AA different. DLAA is anti-aliasing without upscaling. DLSS is upscaling, AA, frame-generation, and soon also RT denoising.
The problem is DLSS should be the AA (as intended) and not the reverse. DLAA should have stayed DLSS and upscaling should have gotten another name.
Thats more due to Nvidia making both Frame Generation, Upscaling and the original use, Anti Aliasing (the SS in DLSS is super sampling) the same term.
Realistically, DLSS should be referred to as an anti aliasing technique(like TAA is) but it was basically colloquially hijacked to turn into an upscaling tech.
Well that’s a tad pedantic. Effectively, if not technically, interpolation is upscaling.
This isn’t anything new, there’s some community software locked behind paywalls like patreon already. Doesn’t mean we have to like it though.
Then again, DLSS is an nvidia product, so there’s a legal issue here I think.
Nah it’s free to use tech, but yes the dev is indeed still charging for something that they themselves could have to pay for but don’t.
Only the mod dev gets to make money, not any of the hundreds of people (if not more) working on the base game.
Come on man it’s fine, charge the little guy, big guy make more money. It’s simple /s
DLSS is free to redistribute. https://developer.nvidia.com/downloads/nvidia-rtx-sdks-license-23jan2023pdf#:~:text=Further%2C the DLSS SDK and,DLSS SDK and NGX SDK.
Unless they go crazy like oracle/Java devs are encouraged to use it.
Dude can charge whatever he wants, and you can choose to buy it or not. Super weird and annoying responses here.
It’s a 1 time $5 fee. People are just mad that they’re broke after buying a 4090. Frustrations should be aimed at Nvidia, not this one dude trying to make a buck
After a 4090 and A 57" Samsung G9, you couldn’t afford a 5 dollar mod either!
If you can’t afford a 5 dollar mod after dropping 5k on gear, you shouldn’t be buying the gear my man lol
People should eat less avocado toast.
Yep, and buy real estate 30 years ago
Oh man, I saw a 2,000 word rant about it on Reddit. Just such whining
As if the dude would have bothered to do it for free? Likely not.
Pay, or don’t, and then reevaluate all the things you do for free and if you have room to stand
I don’t have a problem with some mods being sold. My issue is when you price it initially for free and THEN decide later to charge money for it. That’s within your rights of course, but don’t expect people to not get pissed off enough to pirate it.
Sure modders can put stuff behind paywalls, but implementing DRM, is overkill. And it would be nice if they release month old versions for free afterwards… sSo I have to see, Starfield isn’t that old yet.
BTW, I am not really getting the FSR/DLSS situation.
Shouldn’t FSR2 be working on Nvidia gpus as well and is open source? DLSS is propritary and only works on Nvidia.
So I am not really understanding the issue here, other than customers of Nvidia not having FSR2 because Nvidia hasn’t implemented the open standard, right? So they should complain to them about it.
IMO this is a bit like the fediverse vs. other social media topic, so I would complain about people creating their own propritary stuff, that is intentionally incompatible with the fediverse, and not about people that use the fediverse API in their app, but not support some propritary API.
I think the mod is simply a better implementation of DLSS and one that possibly even works on non-nvidia or non-dlss supported GPUs. IDK, I saw it the other day on Nexus but didn’t get it because FSR works just fine 🤷🏻♂️
What are you talking about? The mod adds dlss frame generation into the game, which only runs on nvidia 40xx gpus.
Most people think DLSS is a better upscaler than FSR so that’s why people wanted DLSS support, but it only works on Nvidia RTX GPUs, while FSR will work on both Nvidia and AMD GPUs. Downside is FSR apparently isn’t as good as DLSS but I can’t confirm that as I have an AMD GPU.
My GPU is Nvidia (1660 Super), but doesn’t support DLSS or doesn’t support the latest iteration of it, I am not entirely sure. I, personally, try to avoid using upscalers and just want the native resolution. This is the only game I have taken advantage of the upscaling for more than just comparison, because it’s almost unplayable without it since the GPU I have is technically below the minimum requirement. My sister has a newer RTX card so I can compare DLSS between FSR, and I can’t even really tell much difference. They’re both blurrier than native, but it’s more noticable on a monitor than a TV.
Yeah anything with a GTX prefix like your 1660S doesn’t support DLSS, only the RTX 2000 and up works. I agree completely, I’ve never used upscaling before as I’d much rather have a clearer picture at native resolution, but if I wanna stay above 30FPS minimums then I need to use FSR with my RX 6700XT running at 1440p. Didn’t think I’d play any games that made my GPU feel that bad for at least another year or two.
As someone who’s been subbed to Puredark for months for his various dlss+fg mods, it makes a big difference!
FSR2 looks like dogshit. DLSS is much better. That’s why.
Just to clarify for everyone, only this clown’s DLSS 3 mod (3 as in frame generation) is paywalld. His dlss 2 mod (2 as in normal dlss) is free on nexus.
Also to all the mental gymnasts trying to justify this horse shit, remember, the patreon sub is $5/MONTH. This means if you buy 1 month at $5 to download the mod, and the author “conveniently” comes out with an update one month later, you need to subscibe for another $5. So basically it’s a fucking subscription for a god damn dlss 3 mod. You know the author is milking this bullshit to keep subscibers and keep his income flowing. Marty mcfly does the same fucking dogshit with his stupid ass RTGI reshade shaders. Fuck that shit. Those people can go get fucked.
Personally I find it hard to care as I won’t be playing the game for longer then a month anyhow. That said, real easy to wait for someone else to drop a dlss3 mod or just go without.
Even easier to download the mod from someone else.
So I take it somebody else is providing a dlss 3 mod for free then?
Yes, it already exists on Nexus, and without ReShade, but it is currently crashing the game a lot for users.
Why would reshade be relevant? I don’t get why without reshade is even worth mentioning?
The DLSS3 mod runs via ReShade. I don’t mind people charging for their work, but this guy is selling access to an Nvidia dll via an open source tool, which I am not a fan of. Not a lot of original work, just repackaging.
I’m talking about the DLSS3 mod with Frame Generation that is free on Nexus and doesn’t rely on ReShade. It was created by another person.
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Why do people hate on it? I thought ot was pretty clear that it’s great. Unfortunately i can’t use it since I have a 3080.
It’s great if you have a decent framerate to start with, but it really struggles at lower framerates and you’ll get a lot of ugly artifacts if there’s any rapid movement on screen.
Where would one pirate thie mod?
An alternative mod that does the same thing is on the* Nexus now; you no longer need to pirate anything. Just download that.
DLSS 3 is far worse than DLSS 2 IMO.
There’s basically zero disadvantage to turning on DLSS 2. Most of the time you cannot or can barely tell the difference.
DLSS 3 introduces lots of artifacting, some frames straight up look like DALL-E image, it adds input lag, and it needs you to already have a high framerate to start with to make it bearable, text in particular gets mangled by it.
Fast paced games and games that rely on quick reactions are a no-go for DLSS 3. It’s suitable for games like MS flight sim where adding input lag doesn’t really matter and there’s not rapid movement.
Knock it off with the fake news. My TV artifacts more than my 4090 when converting 24Hz films to 60/120. You can’t even notice any artifacting in DLSS 3 without taking screenshots and pixel-peeping. Quit talking out of your ass. DLSS 3 FG works amazingly well in Starfield.
If you think you can’t see any artifacting with DLSS 3 then you are crazy.
You’re arguing about visual fidelity with someone who uses their TV to “convert 24hz movies to 120fps”. It’s the equivalent of the guy who got into a heated debate over Italian food with a Redditor that also posted about drinking his own piss on /r/piss.
Yes, because comparing apples to oranges is the same thing as drinking your own piss. Get real, my dude.
Do you not understand how analogy works? Nobody is comparing what you did with drinking piss.
Gaming community reaction to new games in 2023:
Starfield: install these community mods to get the game to look good, 9/10, GOTY candidate
Jedi Survivor: some performance issues but overall complete, 2/10
Diablo 4: technically flawless, 0/10, wanted Diablo 3
BG3: same issues as Jedi Survivor but no one cares, 10/10, definite GOTY
BG3 one is so true. The game is clunky and finicky as hell. Everyone praising it as being polished breaks my brain.
I got it on PS5 (co-op) and in the space of 2 hours had randomly silent cutscenes, an invisible character in one, and my PSN Name and a mute icon permanently stuck the top left of the screen where all the information about rolls and characters liking or disliking things should appear.
Didn’t get any tutorials either, which is apparently a thing. So we’re just randomly pressing things and hoping it doesn’t fuck up the story for later.
It’s really quite broken in places.
Well, Just download a D&D 5th edition player manual
The game rules here are actually very different. I play a ton of 5e D&D and it’s close enough to be useful but different enough to trip me up. S great example I just found out last night after over 80 hours of play as a Paladin: the smite spells last 10 turns and apply to each attack. In 5e the smite spells only affect one attack and are usually worse than divine smite (which isn’t a spell be uses a spell slot) because divine smite you decide to use when you hit so it never wastes a spell slot while the others can miss.
I would copy it but the fucking D&D Beyond app prevents copying. The smite spells in 5e say “on the next hit” basically. A lot of spells in BG3 have simplified descriptions and it’s hard to know when it is different language or a different effect.
What do you find clunky in the game?
Inventory is clunky as fuck. When I Ctrl click multiple items and pick up and add to wares nearly 100% of the time it fails on the first and I have to do it a second time. Dragging items to other characters when inventories are filtered will actually swap with the item that would be in that slot of their pack without the filter rather than the one showing. Opening containers (especially the ones that need an item inserted like puzzles) get covered by the main inventory and I have to drag them over. Everything with moving items around just feels slow as hell in general. I can’t manage characters’ inventory unless they’re in the party so I have to go through the dialogue to kick someone out then let someone join which isn’t all that long but can add up when they’re on opposite sides of camp and you realize you forgot something. The search is nice but why not let us search camp inventory too, that’s where most of my crap is. Items in containers in your inventory can help with clutter but they aren’t added to the hot bar automatically.
Last night I had two enemies spasm out of existence. One of them was so glitched that the game crashed when I killed them. I’ve had multiple enemies just sit as round for nearly ten seconds or more trying to decide what to do before they do it sometimes even at the end of their turn. When dealing with elevation in battles it is absolutely awful to try and target shit above you, there’s no way to have the camera “move up a floor”, you can sort of get around this by selecting an enemy on that floor but it’s tricky. Trying to do anything precise in combat is a pain. There’s no easy way to get you character to jump the maximum distance without moving first for example. Also it’s an annoying choice to make jumping take movement like 5e but also take a bonus action like D&D One, it should be one or the other, not both. There’s no easy way to save 10 ft of movement at the end, you’ll move 20 ft only to realize you have 9.9 ft of movement left and don’t have 10 ft for the jump.
There’s no way to demo what a dye will look like before using it. There’s no way to know if an item it’s dyed and with what. There’s no way to add wares to the barter screen (which is what the name wares seems to imply to me), only on the trade screen.
I’ve had a few dialogues that were confusing and seemed to rely on events that didn’t happen. Astarion told me he was a vampire then later but me but still acted like it was a big reveal moment. When clearing out the Githyanki creche multiple characters said something about how it’s a good thing we didn’t nuke them or something? That was never an option I saw. No idea what they’re talking about.
Characters will willfully walk into things that damage them including spotted traps and AOE spells from the battle they were in rather than walk around them. This is not in turn based mode, this is real time. When in real time why not just walk around it rather than mindlessly walk towards the player? Even if you want to blame me for the traps saying I should be in turn based mode (which is silly because they know the trap is there, it is spotted) when a battle ends with an AOE damage effect still on the field they automatically enter turn based mode and walk to me through it and take damage.
I’ve had times where I told them to walk somewhere only for the game to say I can’t get there so I have to figure out a tricky jump. Then everyone will walk around some nearby path and get to me without doing a jump at all.
Lit areas around characters die to weapons or spells do not show up with the clear outline that stationary lights have when in stealth mode.
This is all shit just off the top of my head. I’m fully aware a lot of it is minor. I’m fully aware a lot of it can be somewhat avoided or dealt with. It just frustrates me to no end to see people defending this game as if their baby is being attacked. Here’s the thing: I love this game! I’ve been enjoying it a lot! But that doesn’t mean it doesn’t have bugs. It doesn’t mean it is above criticism. A game can be a great game and still have flaws. It just irks me to no end to see how so many of the reviews of the game call it polished when it’s just not. Especially when the context of a lot of the reviews are spinning a narrative that this game should set a new standard that triple A studios have failed to meet. This feels like every Bethesda game (pre Fallout 76) did on launch: a ton of promise and a lot of fun but very rough around the edges. And I don’t appreciate it when fans of the game mock and victim blame me for problems in the game.
Not OP, and I’ve been loving the game, but it does have some jank. Pretty early in act 1 I came across a bugged quest which I couldn’t complete. Couple the occasional bugs with my inexperience never playing a game like this before and a somewhat unintuitive interface/help system, and it made for a pretty clunky onboarding experience. Now that I’ve more got the hang of things it feels better. But I needed to look for help outside of the game to really get a handle on it.
I’ve never finded bugs (Just the horny npcs One) that’s probably me being lucky. I do agree that without knowledge of a tabletop gdr or at least of other Classic RPG it’s pretty hard do get inside the mechanics. A Better tutorial Is probabily needed but still you can inspect every Word using “T” on the keyboard and read the rules
Yeah, once I figured out how the inspect menu worked, I started learning much faster. I feel a little dumb regarding that. When I first tried it, I just saw that it made the tooltip stick on the screen, I didn’t realize I could hover over the text for more information. So I just went “huh, that’s dumb” and barely used it again until I saw someone online do it lol.
And for what it’s worth, other than the quest bug, the rest of it is mostly just me feeling out the game, which I’m fine with and had fun with, just did a lot of save scumming. I’ve played MMOs so the interfaces and whatnot aren’t completely unfamiliar, but before this game I was only vaguely aware of how tabletop RPGs work
Some of the tooltips are wrong.
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To be fair to Starfield, if you’re playing on the recommended hardware it runs incredibly well. I’m running a 7900xt and a Ryzen 7600X and the lowest fps I have with everything on ultra at 1440p is 80, don’t need any mods.
Edit: also Diablo 4 sucks because they turned it into another MMO with a battlepass that nobody wanted.
Jedi survivor and Baldur’s gate 3 are in very different genres. Performance issues in a turn based game is way more forgivable imo
Diablo 4 technically flawless? The game barely works to this day. Just check the patch notes of how many abilities weren’t working. It’s still awesome but lol
Ghost of Tsushima: narrative masterpiece, evokes the sensibilities of a time and place, despite (very) infrequent frame stuttering–particularly if there are large crowds. F-
When did that come to PC?
That McFly guy has been riding the “It’ll be released soon™” train for something like five years at this point.
Does this type of mod break with updates, or could you potentially just stay on the version you downloaded and forego any updates? I don’t mod much to the point where I’ve paid for any, but curious the requisite of ongoing subscription for this type of thing.
That’s a good question. I’m not sure but I’d assume it would break with updates. I was thinking more about just updates the author makes to make the mod better. Likely he’ll keep working on making it better but you can bet your booty thay he’ll keep making minor updates once a month to milk his subsciber’s money. Patreon is a fucking scam.
It could. No way to tell for sure until it happens
Okay but Martys RTGI is great and works in quite alot of games without much tinkering (just need to access depth buffer), don’t mind paying for it. Useally sub and let it expire once every few years.
“I don’t mind buying my own painting and then paying monthly for it to have some details filled in that eventually get painted over anyway at some rate”
Is it morally wrong to have someone spy on the detail painter and copy their techniques? (In this metaphor techniques are DLSS implementation, not the paint (DLSS itself))
I don’t feel bad for anyone pushing a subscription model.
The modder also locked the DLSS3 mod behind a paywall, and players also pirated that 🤣
No, DLSS3 was the only one he wanted $5 for.
Out of this whole thing, I just want to say something about this.
Everyone needs to make bread. Someone asking for money from their mod or map or whatever isn’t against any spirit. It’s just a human being asking to make bread. Now some don’t agree with the price tag and that’s fine.
But we all need to recognize humans asking for some dough for their hard work is in the spirit of existing. Some folk do it for free just for the feelings and we love ‘em for it. But those asking for some cash are no different.
This world is already full of dog eat dog. Let’s not hate on someone just trying to get through it. You don’t have to pay the ask, but let’s not go making enemies just cause we don’t agree on that number on the price tag.
You don’t go into modding for the money. It’s like making a non profit for the money. That’s why they’re getting backlash, they’re asking money where money’s not supposed to be involved.
it’s like theyre making a non profit for the money, except the without the making a non profit part
This is such a shitty attitude 🤣
God forbid we pay for a fucking cup of coffee because that person should want to work for free. This is the same bullshit as “work hard play hard” and “we are family here”. Might as well start telling modders it’s not about the pay, it’s the people and experience we’re paying you in. Rent what’s that?
You are all on a lemmy instance after 2 months of non stop bitching about non paid reddit moderators. Make up your damn mind.
Yes, again you don’t mod for the money. If you’re looking for that, you can create your own software. Other people in this thread made other good points, and this guy was trying to make a dlss mod subscription based, so fuck that guy. It’s literally better if the mod doesn’t exist in that case. Like I said with my analogy, it’s like trying to create a non-profit for the profit. There’s a million other avenues available to them if they want money. Especially because they are basing their work off of other’s work whom are not getting paid, yet they are?
Also idk what you’re talking about with the mod stuff but I do think it’s dumb internet janitors do work for free lol, and they do it for power. I don’t think they should be paid either.
There are tons of paid mods for lots of games. Me thinking it’s just Bethesda fans
Like what
For real. You want it for free? Cool go ahead and make the mod yourself. All the tools are there. Wait, you don’t want to spend your time learning to code? You don’t want to spend your time learning modding tools. Our time is our most finite resource and you get mad when someone asks for something in return for theirs? People are just up their own asses.
The reason why he charges does not matter at all. Anyone wanting a service for free is not in the position to demand anything. Would it be nice to get stuff for free? Sure! But demanding free service and badmouthing if you don’t get it? Fuck off.
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Wtf are you talking about, Skyrim has dozens of amazing quest mods, and hundreds of quest mods overall.
It has major gameplay overhauls, it has custom skeletons for animation, it literally has mods that rework the animation system entirely. Modders added a survival system almost a full decade before Bethesda did.
There are mods that add new continents ffs, what’re you talking about? One of the quest mods was so good it literally got turned into its own game.
Edit: There are currently 60k mods for Skyrim Special Edition, and about 70k for the original Skyrim. Meanwhile Morrowind has 11k. Wtf are you talking about??
I didn’t hear about the quest mod getting its own game, what’s it called?
The Forgotten City
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The Forgotten City has “overwhelmingly positive” reviews on Steam with many people praising it for its Bethesda-like systems, so I’m not sure what you mean. Maybe you felt it wasn’t enough like Skyrim and disliked it for that, but clearly you don’t speak for others.
Also, no other Skyrim quest mod, out of the near 2 thousand quest mods for the game, had a full game built off of them. So while that does happen sometimes (ie Dayz), it’s exceedingly rare and far from some sort of “tradition” as you put it. If anything that was far more common a decade or two ago than it is now. The original Star Wars Battlefront mod was quite a long time ago after all.
And no I’m not mad, I’m just confused as to how you could think Skyrim has only bug fixes, UI, and graphics mods, when in reality it has nearly 7x the amount of mods that Morrowind has and is the primary example of a thriving modding scene. Idk if you just spouted that out without knowing, or what.
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This is pretty long response lol so I’ll tackle each point individually.
Your whole argument on niche games getting good reviews, I actually fully agree with. The problem is that those reviews are literally the only metric we have to discern whether or not the people that played it enjoyed it - anything else is pure speculation. Including your point about people not liking it if they felt it didn’t feel enough like Skyrim, or people saying they like it just to appease others. It’s frankly bizarre that you’d make an argument for Steam Reviews not 100% showing the accuracy of people’s opinions, while simultaneously making statements like those with zero anything to back them up.
At the very least the reviews tell us that people who played it say they liked it. That’s just a fact. And considering that that’s all we have, I think it’s fair to use it. Anything else, again, is just pure speculation.
This was weird lol.
No, it doesn’t. Skyrim has over 70k mods while Morrowind has roughly 11k. Even if there were over one hundred missing quest mods for Morrowind, which I doubt, it still wouldn’t affect that massive difference.
This… just isn’t how modding works. Most new games releasing will have some reshades and a trainer, max. Once in a great while you’ll get some nudity. The size of the audience doesn’t change that - most games releasing simply don’t garner much mod support.
By your logic a game like Call of Duty should have a massive modding scene, as the new entry will be newer and have a massive audience, an audience multiple times bigger than any Bethesda game. But no, that’s just not how that works. Hell, even a game like The Witcher 3 only has half the number of mods that Morrowind does.
Also I’m confused as to the point of those links. Are you arguing that gaming has… gotten more popular over the years? Yeah no shit. As I said earlier, numbers going up doesn’t magically guarantee a thriving modding scene.
As I went over before, no. Lol absolutely not. I don’t believe that you actually think this could possibly be true. Lets apply your logic to other mainstream games releasing nowadays and see if that logic holds water (hint, it doesn’t).
This comment was truly a trip, thank you.
You’re fucking with us, right? RIGHT?? 😂
I am not disagreeing with the premise that it’s fair for someone to be paid for their work. However, during the Skyrim paid mod controversy (on Steam), I learned that there a lot of situations where having paid mods did hurt the modding community and created ethical concerns.
I would also point out that it wasn’t just greedy players that complained about paid mods - a lot of modders thought it went against the spirit of modding because of how it harmed collaboration in the community. Suddenly, they couldn’t trust that others would not steal their work or profit from it unfairly. And, that seems like a reasonable take to me, given all the abuses that modders claimed happened in the short time that paid modding was a thing for Skyrim on Steam.
It feels like the issue is that it was offering the convenience of payment to mods, but not really thinking about the necessary friction of assuring licenses/legality/etc. All of that CAN, of course, be an issue for cheap Unity games too. I remember back when Steam Greenlight started, they required each game to donate $100 to charity to even be considered, basically placing a bet of assurance that it wasn’t a stolen asset flip (I don’t know if they still do that).
I think you’re exactly right - it is the combination of money + little oversight that is the big problem. Warframe seems to do a good job with tennogen but they limit it to only cosmetic mods and seem to be pretty restrictive about what they accept into their store. I don’t see how you could have good oversight for a game with as many mods as something like Skyrim has.
It’s not “oversight”, but if a modder needs to create their own storefront and Paypal integration, and advertising through word of mouth and their own social contacts (as in this case it seems), then that’s going to offer a lot more scrutiny than a low-effort asset flipper presenting themselves anonymously through Steam’s given storefront.
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The game has just launched and the mod had been released and cracked already. This isn’t about making bread, it’s clearly a trivial hack for him to do, not something that requires full time job maintenence.
People spend hundreds of hours modding free of charge, what he does is a joke in comparison if we are talking about lost time that could have been spent earning money. The groundwork was made by Bethesda, AMD and Nvidia.
Remember, the patreon sub is $5/MONTH. This means if you buy 1 month at $5 to download the mod, and the author “conveniently” comes out with an update one month later, you need to subscibe for another $5. So basically it’s a fucking subscription for a god damn dlss 3 mod. You know the author is milking this bullshit to keep subscibers and keep his income flowing. Marty mcfly does the same fucking dogshit with his stupid ass RTGI reshade shaders. Fuck that shit. Those people can go get fucked.
If you want to charge $5 or $10 for your time spent making the mod, fine, whatever. But if you are trying to make it a subscription model then I have ZERO sympathy for you.
Ultimately, the guy is being upfront with his pricing and what he’s asking for. What’s the reason to hate on him? Either it’s worth it at that price or it’s not.
So you’re invalidating the feeling of being upset when something that used to be free (modding games) is no longer free. Modding has always been a free hobby that was run by good-willed pc gamers. Now monetization is fragmenting and ruining the modding experience.
You’re also justifying paying a subsciption on top of a fucking $70 game. Do you rip up a $5 bill every time you take a shit? Try it out. You may enjoy it.
they cant invalidate the feeling of being upset when something that used to be free (modding games) is no longer free
modding games is still free, so your feeling of being upset wasnt valid in the first place
No, I’d just choose not to use it and move on. Or if I’m broke and really wanted it, sure, pirate it. Not act like an entitled brat and whine and moan and it
You must be one of those whales that buys $4k worth of micro transactions. You do you man.