For those who have pre-ordered it is already here, the rest have to wait a little longer. Starfield is finally here! Have you bought it, why or why not? If you’ve already played it, what do you think of it? We are very curious!
So far I’m a few hours in and I’ve been having a great time. My hardware is closer to the minimum requirements, so I’ve had some issues with my resolution throttling back to keep framerate up in the busiest areas. So far, no significant bugs experienced, assuming the aforementioned texture resolution fuzzing was intentional.
I will say I’ve found all the complaints about loading screens to be a little silly. Again, I’m closer to the minimum hardware level on PC but most loading screens I encounter have been around 3-5 seconds, and they’re generally made up for with other conveniences like the ability, when planetside, to fast travel not just directly to your ship, but Into the pilot’s seat, so I’m spending a lot less time loading than I would have just walking through doors.
All in all so far it feels like exactly what I was expecting.
specifically to the loading screens point, I guess it’s about expectations. Since this is such a huge game advertised as exploration-based people might find too many loading screens immersion-breaking.
God I was about to downvote you because of the spaceship comment. Like “Damn, some guy literally gives you his spaceship and puts you into the combat tutorial in the first 30 minutes.”
I love the comments that arent getting the joke, though.
I see exactly what I expected. I didn’t bought the hysteria on Youtube/insta/TK.
And I didn’t preorder the game because of that hysteria. The Hysteria looked a lot like the Cyberpunk Fiasco. Realistic expectations, we seem to have lost that capability with upcoming video games. When something sounds too good, It is.
TH: “We do lock it at 30 [FPS], because we want that fidelity, we want all that stuff.”
That means 1 thing: not a real action game, more in line of FO4, maybe NMS like but more like RDR. A dogfight @30FPS is over before it starts. Beauty is more important then speed for this game.
Speaking about RDR, TH: “So I think it also as a flow, probably has more of a feeling of a [Red Dead Redemption 2]”
Here you have it literally: a game like RDR. Not NMS. Not Elite. Not StarCitizen. But like RDR. That means that the ships are more of a means of transport then a real gameplay mechanic. And space is just the theme.
TH: “this is like five or six games in one, right? It’s the spaceship game, it’s the on the ground game, it’s just a dialogue game, it’s an outpost game, it’s a crafted game. It does all of these things, and so… And it always is tricky for us to get a good game flow where those things don’t feel like they’re separate game”
That means the spaceship part is not front and center. All these things he states are just pieces for a standard RPG:
Ground game: Loot and shoot.
Dialogue game: standard RPG.
Outpost game: base building.
Crafting? Standard part of every RPG in the last decade.
Add to that it’s build with the Bethesda engine. We know it’s capabilities for what… 2 decades? We flew in FO4. But we didn’t steer… It was on rails
This all meant in my mind that the spaceship part had to be a transportation mini game.
So reading the official stuff, I always expected a mix between FO4 and Mass Effect. With a mobile “base” (your ship) with maybe some light spaceship combat. Sprinkled with some exploration.
Not a game which morphed all those separate game types. Just an FP/3rd p ARPG set in a cool science fiction universe.
The standard editing that comes with gamepass officially releases 9/6 in the US but due to timezones could be playable 9/5 in the evening. So it could only be a couple more days for the general release assuming you are in the US.
I7-11/3070/32GB and I have been having a lot of fun. I play all games on very hard and this one I was thinking maybe I should tone it down. I didn’t and I didn’t regret it.
30+ hours in and after reading this thread I feel like some people just got unlucky or were expecting something like SC or SpaceBourne 2. This isn’t those games and weren’t promised to be. I play both of those games and SC is a mess 12 years and $600k later and SB2 is awesome and only made by one guy! But this game is way polished and ready by comparison. By far imo.
I was maybe 4 hours in and got sidetracked in a solar system surveying everything. I forgot about the original quest to scan a moon and just traveled to every planet and not only had a great time scanning and scouting across different moons and planets but was also helping randoms with distress calls and 3 on 1 battles against Spacers in spaceships. By the time I was done with that solar system I was 18 hours in.
I would scan a planet, find a spot to land and drop in. Scout every place that popped up and then set another course on the same planet and repeat. Never did I feel bored or that I was going to see the same assets. Every spot felt unique and well designed. One planet felt like the American Southwest, it was so beautiful.
I highjacked a landed vessel during my surveying mission and upgraded and redesigned it for more maneuverability and storage and I have to say that the ship editor is so well done. I have 1000+ hours in FO76 and the camp building in that was really great and Bethesda has made the industry standard camp building format in SC. It is really an improvement from FO4 to current. I cannot wait until the mods really open this masterpiece up.
I haven’t even touched the base building yet btw.
The space combat is solid. From what I gather people don’t really know how to do space combat. Especially when in bulk freight ships or similar. You have to boost right at them guns blazing and then hard turn when you pass them so you can get behind them. Watch your throttle as you will only turn fast when it’s at halfway (within the white lines). I can take on 3 Spacer attackers on very hard difficulty with this method. If you can track the enemy (perk i think?) do it and just kill their shields and weapons. If you just kill their engines they love to just tumble in space and shoot at you. I usually kill two and then disable the third and board. It’s hard af and fun af.
I would like to be able to spacewalk but also see why it’s not included in Starfield. It’s fun but as I have experienced it in SC all of that extra functionality doesn’t really add to the game. It’s a pain to get out of your ship and fly over to the enemy ship and then try to gain access. I like the way Bethesda did it. Super easy.
Also the space travel is super easy. Fast traveling is great and keeps the game going without having problems finding where you want to go. SC has this problem. Their map of one solar system is terrible and doesn’t work half of the time. It’s only 1 solar system and barely works. Not to mention the navigation in SC and SB2 typically bug out and don’t work which calls for a reboot. Bethesda said fuck that and did better. Sure it’s not as immersive but immersion really has potential to take away from the game and progress.
The overall look and feel is what I was hoping in FO76. Vast improvement. The gunplay is on par with what I want and expect. Fighting on moon bases is fucking awesome. On very hard the enemies are harder, their tactics are okay, not great, but challenging enough to keep you guessing. Abandoned bases are always fun to attack. Loot is everywhere.
Some NPCs are bugged. It’s annoying but infrequent enough to not be a game breaker. The NPCs just talking to you randomly is weird, especially when you are walking through a city and your companion is already talking to you. Needs work.
I caught Shrouds stream and it looks like this game just gets better. I can’t wait to jump back in.
Hyperion+Endymion by Dan Simmons. Such a wonderfully written book that evokes so many sad feelings.
It’s veeeery slow (basically the entire first book is build up for the second one), but it’s so rewarding watching all the threads come together by the end.
I mean, we were clearly all so patiently holding our respective breath for this absolute genius comment of yours to grace our screens, O’ wisest of asses. What’s a little longer, really?
You spend less than $60 in two years’ time? Your Internet bill must be the cheapest on the planet. Your grocery expenses must also be next to nothing if you’re surviving on the warmth of your hot air whinging alone . Fascinating.
Yeah we pay an 80% markup just for existing and I hate it, but the gaming industry has been dropping quality while simultaneously increasing prices for some time now.
The only games in the last couple years I’ve paid full price for are CP2077, BG3 and Battlebit. Everything else is bought during the sales, usually at a steep discount, where many of these games should be priced by default.
Fuckin corpo dogs, they’ll ruin anything and everything they can to make a buck.
Lmao I only buy games when they’re discounted too and suddenly I have 186 games in my steam library, most of them are still unplayed . I’m not in a hurry to buy more games with such a long backlog.
Being a patient gamer isn’t strictly about money. It’s about not getting caught up in hype and making more calculated decisions. Even so, wanting to pay what you think something is worth is just good practice.
I’m not going to wait two years – though I’m opposed to preordering – but there are other benefits too. Two years down the line:
A bunch of bugs are patched. Even if Starfield is relatively free of bugs, there will be some.
The wikis for the game have been written up. Some obsessive person will have sat down and figured out the quirks of game mechanics and documented them. Understanding stuff like the relative merits of armor-piercing, bleeding, and so forth in Fallout 4 was complicated.
Starfield’s expansion packs will be out.
Mods will be out, and there will probably be some pretty “must have” ones.
You’ll have more hardware oomph to throw at the game, make it smoother/higher res.
Mods are the very first thing that turns me off in a game. I want to play a game, not go stack mods on top of mods just to fix the shit the studio didn’t feel like working on.
But Cities Skylines 1 is borderline unplayable outside of Steam because the non-steam players can’t use that one third-party traffic mod on the Steam Workshop that fixes the annoying only-one-lane traffic jams the devs did jack shit about until their recently-released sequel
100% true - but if people feel the need to create so many mods, then there are probably lots of things people feel aren’t good enough about the game. I’ll admit my gaming time is limited, so just researching and adding mods could easily take all my time. I mean, fuck, I sold my Warthog HOTAS and went back to a cheap thrusmaster not because I liked the thrustmaster better, but because I was spending more time writing and fixing scripts and updating my bindings than actually playing the game. And every time an update would come out that would break a script I would spend pretty much my entire gaming time budget for a couple weeks just getting it running again. It got to the point where I just didn’t play those games because every patch would change something and something (even something small) would break or be incompatible. I’m kind of over that.
Boy oh boy everyone hates inventory limits and tedious management but devs still feel the need to make sure we have a reason to return towns and what not as the excuse.
Like fuck you, give me a better reason than inconveniencing the fuck out of me while I was out in your world having fun.
cough Baldur’s Gate 3 cough. Why impose an inventory limit if I can just send all the loot I’m gunna sell back to camp? And why no quick “send to camp” hotkey?! Right clickin n shiiittt
I beg to differ. It’s the most beautiful of the Bethesda games by far, very immersive without having to have the main character have dialogue (fallout 4). Tons of items, crafting, research, outposts, ships. This game is huge. Absolutely love it.
I’ve played oblivion, skyrim and fallout 3 and 4. While it’s similar engine of game, this game blew it out of the park.
What I’m learning is that I’m really glad that I told myself I wouldn’t be buying it until it was on sale post-launch to see if it was even worth the sale price
I waited until I could see video of people actually playing the game. I like how it looks. I decided to just purchase the base game, so I haven’t played it yet but I’m okay with waiting va few days. Also I got my Steam key $5 off on Newegg so paid $65. I’ll wait to buy all of the DLC in a bundle sometime down the road and it will give the game new life for another playthrough.
Played for 3 hours yesterday on a 3070, 10700k, 32GB ram. Game runs and looks incredible on high/ultra settings. I haven’t gotten far into the story, but the beginning gets into the action very fast like Skyrim.
The animations and textures make npcs feel more alive than fallout. I made it to the first city area and it looks amazing. It looks like mirrors edge type city in space
Definitely get a decent 1440p monitor with high refresh rate and GSync and then you are set. If you get it used it probably won’t even be that expensive (that’s how I got mine around 2 years ago).
Monitors last a long time so it’s not something that you will just toss, and a 3070 with 1080p is such a waste imo
Yeahhh, I found a great deal on this monitor but I was a dumbass and didn’t know how bad the down-rez is when running 1080p on a 1440p monitor😅
Other than not being able to use raytracing in CP2077 it hasn’t been a problem, but I’m think I’m going to start running into trouble from this point on. Oh well, I was thinking of getting another monitor for my workflow anyway…
Watched a streamer play for quite a while and my primary takeaway is that I wish Bethesda would just scrap their engine and start fresh.
It’s got the same stiffness, gliding movement, butt-ugly NPC’s, and just the general feel of 15 year old Bethesda RPGs. I expect I wouldn’t be able to enjoy it for the same reason I struggled with fallout 4.
I respect the sentiment, so no disrespect to it; but in software, there’s often a lot of caution against throwing out too much code.
You often find certain modules and sections of code that really should be thrown out or overhauled. If you can convince the corporation to dedicate time to doing that, it can often, but not always, show its benefits.
Probably a lot of the popular games we still play use some old bases, but replace parts that don’t work well. I think Apex Legends is still technically using Source (HL2), they’ve just done a lot to it so it no longer looks anything like Half Life 2.
Okay but Bethesdas engine kinda sucks and source engine is still pretty good… Why keep something if it’s not very good, other than to save money of course.
I’m done paying anything above half off a Bethesda games since fallout 4/76 anyway, they were bad and awful.
They’ve been saying a new engine for a long time. It’s just not. they change subsystems, but people are saying they can feel the morrowind in their latest titles.
Yeah it’s really weird to feel it again in a game. Especially coming from baldurs gate 3 where the npc interactions and realness of characters is so good
To be thrown into npc dialogue straight at you with no natural movement.
Otherwise the game is really cool so far. Flight is a little complex but I guess I’ll get used to it. The robot even says it’ll be like second nature soon. Assume he was talking directly to the player
I’ve never understood this argument, most game engines are based on 20+ year old technology and have been updated throughout the years. Can the creation engine be improved upon? Definitely yes, but the engine’s age has almost nothing to do with it.
UE5 doesn’t still have UE2 limitations. Gamebryo still won’t let me climb ladders. It’s clear that UE has been upgraded extensively, while Gamebryo has not.
The one thing Unreal still has bug wise is the fact I can’t place hundreds of actors in a blueprints viewport because it lags like Satan but if I run code that spawns the same amount attached to said actor or drag the same quantity into the level itself it works without issue.
One thing I did want in Fallout 4 that I don’t believe it presently does is dynamic generation of polygons in curves.
The game has environments with kinda curvy surfaces, but aside from the dynamic level of detail models, the engine can’t go throw spare horsepower at generating more polygons to make smoother curves. I think that that’s a good match with long-lived PC games, because people playing it years later on more-powerful hardware can burn their extra cycles on making things pretty.
It’s not vital or anything, just think that if there’s one game where it’d be neat, it’d be Bethesda-type games.
Yeah, they can just append a number to it like unreal does and call it a new engine but that’s not what you actually want. It’s not a matter of a “new engine”, it’s them not investing enough into the existing one to make it feel more modern. I know some things like physics and animations are part of the “bethesda charm” but it stopped being charming after skyrim :P
Skyrim literally had some of the same exact problems that Morrowind had.
Personally I want them to keep the creation engine, if only for the stellar mod support. But let’s not kid ourselves, it desperately needs an overhaul.
I listed one feature that I’d like to have (dynamic generation of polygons in curved surfaces), which I do not consider to be a very important limitation in another comment.
But if you strongly feel that the engine imposes constraints, then I’m curious what particular functionality it is that you’re after.
EDIT: Another: I don’t think that the game can generate billboards for player-built structures (so you can see the structures you’ve built in Fallout 4 and Fallout 76 many cells away). I don’t think that that’s actually a fundamental engine limitation – you could probably do it with the existing engine, just that the game doesn’t do it today. Instead, stuff like that is generated via offline map-generation tools. But again, it’s not really a huge deal in either of the above Fallout games.
There’s no specific functionality (except maybe ladders lol) it’s more just the engine as a whole. The fact that certain bugs can be found in all of their games from Morrowind to Fallout 4 is unacceptable imo.
And the fact that someone managed to literally put the world of Fallout 4 into Skyrim, and have it just work seamlessly, really speaks volumes.
I actually wrote an explanation for someone else a while ago, so I’ll put it here if you’re curious:
The problem isn’t the engine itself, it’s that Bethesda hasn’t given it the attention it needs.
Unreal Engine 5, for example, is built from the original Unreal Engine. But there has been so much work put into it that it’s nearly impossible to tell. Meanwhile, the creation engine literally has some of the same issues that the Gambryo engine had back during Morrowind.
To Bethesda’s credit, this isn’t entirely their fault. There’s a reason that proprietary engines have been dying out in favor of engines like Unreal, and that’s because maintaining and improving game engines is incredibly time consuming and expensive. And unless you’re directly profiting off of your engine, like Epic does, you don’t have a massive incentive to endlessly polish it. Doing so is time you could be spending working on your next game, which you do directly profit off of.
Personally, I want Bethesda to keep using the Creation Engine, or whatever they turn it into next, because of its incredible mod support. However, it’s nowhere near as polished or advanced as other engines, and understandably probably never will be. There’s really no easy solution imo.
Modern game engines are extremely complex machines, starting from scratch would take decades because it’s fundermental things like drawing geometry in a 3D space, getting input, memory handling, garbage collection and all that low level stuff that needs to be re-done. Physics requires lots of work, so much infact for a time HAVOK was the go to plugin for most engines (still kinda is) just because of how God damn hard it is to have nice physics and high frame rates (tried to build a physics engine from scratch in C++ and I couldn’t get past the floating point position problem so anything too far away from 0,0,0 would spaz and handling multiple collisions on an object simultaneously caused all sorts of freaky things to happen).
Then when that’s done you still need to write additional tools and plugins so developers can import assets and scripts into the engine plus a level editor for designers to place objects, triggers and all that fun stuff.
After that you can now start making the game.
Bethesda probably rewrote huge chunks of their engine to support larger texture sizes and improve performance across the board for Starfield.
If they do decide to dump it then they’re most likely to use an existing engine like Unreal or Cry rather than build one from scratch.
Personally I believe the reason why they didn’t re-write the character movement is because it would also mean altering way to much stuff on the front end.
A good example would be if I use FunctionGetVelocity in my script to determine if a player is moving and it use to return an int but now it returns a float because of the rewrite, without conversion would mean you’d probably get a crash.
Another example would be AI related. If I use a variable to get a rot data type but now that’s been replaced with a struct that needs to be split to get rot now suddenly you have to touch the code to make it compliant.
Which is why I’m sad that cdpr decided to ditch their red engine. So much work turning a buggy mess engine from Witcher 2 into a beautiful (still buggy) engine in cyberpunk. If only they would at least open source it, or sell it to another studio.
With nanite, live coding and lumen Unreal is unbeatable at the moment and lots of studios are hiring like crazy for Unreal Engine specialists to try and beat the competition.
If CDPR wants to compete they’ll have to do a ton of work making those tools for designers and artists easy to use (alot more in-house engines still have source 2 hammer editor style toolkits and command line conversion tools which are shit compared to Unreals drag and drop advantage).
Plus Unreal 4/5 was built to be as modular as possible so you can build whatever you want while CDPR engine was built specifically for this genre of games Cyberpunk is in. They definitely could and I see the engine having potential but afraid that’s it’s not flexible enough without serious work.
They’ve never been able to get player models and expression right. I can totally forgive it if you get the same level of open world exploration and interaction we got in New Vegas. I personally can trade quality for depth and interesting gameplay (rimworld and dwarf fortress come to mind in the extremes of this). But it does seem like they struggle to achieve standards that were set even 5 years ago.
Bethesda is a funny company. When they are on it and get it right you end up with some of the best games ever made (Skyrim) but when they’re off it just becomes this jumbled mess that got duct taped together and released at full price (fo76).
I’m hoping this is more of the former but we will see. I suspect the modding community is going to take starfield and turn it into something magical. That ship building engine plus copyrighted space ships from pop culture, sign me up.
I think the hardest thing to do is having complex facial expressions overlapping when characters talk. You could do face capture for every dialog option but that would be a massive task.
In alot of engines characters mouths are controlled by a lip sync system that uses, pitch, tone or text fed dialog to ‘mimic’ words being formed in the mouth. It’s far easier to have that and then having facial expressions as a separate animation layer that’s blended together and triggered based on a enum that’s selected by a script (say a players dialog option says “Your a mean man” and the player selects it, the NPC knows what you selected and in that dialogue option theirs a little enum (it makes more sense if you treat a dialogue option as an object) that contains the facial expression or expressions that are appropriate to use in response).
Full facial animations are used mostly for cutscenes because actors cost money while in game is just the engine trying to move the mouth using code (I know Farcry 5 had this where only the important characters had full facial animations and the rest just flapped their mouths up and down).
Would anyone else be interested in a game that aborts a dedicated “conversation mode” to just have players respond in their normal first person view? Games like Titanfall 2 did that - even though your banter with BT is inconsequential.
It could even lead to some fun “actions not words” moments. Like, a gangster explaining to you “I have the council in my pocket and every gun in the city knows your face. What’re you gonna do about it?” shoots him in the head instead of responding
Careful. The last time I spoke ill of Gamebryo+++++++ I was the subject of a short-lived harassment campaign. Bethesda fans are bizarrely protective of this Frankenstein engine. Get this: you still can’t climb ladders! It’s fucking 2023.
Their engines have been showing it’s age since Skyrim came out. The fact that they got this far is a testament to their willpower, but man, if they’d change it up it might work out really well for them.
I’ve been playing their games since oblivion, I haven’t played this one yet, but if people are complaining about the engine already then I know there’s a decent chance I’ll air the same grievances.
Though, you’re quick to pull out the grass touching, I must ask, why are you so staunch of a defender of Bethesda? Maybe we both should be touching grass.
Nope, talking in general, and thanks for proving my point as well!
So if you’ve played all their games, you should know exactly what to expect and shouldn’t have any complaints than… you’ve enjoyed the game and engine, if you want something new, don’t buy their products and support their decisions……
Where am I defending Bethesda…? I’m defending facts and truth, I’m adding a little of my own opinion, but that shouldn’t be discouraged. But everything I’ve stated is based on facts, it’s a new engine, yes it has issues, so does every other engine……
I’m also not convinced that ladder-climbing, whether one wants it or not, is a fundamental engine limitation. It might not be in the game, but that doesn’t imply that it’s an engine limitation.
googles
This guy modded climbable ladders into Fallout 4, which seems like a pretty good argument that it’s not an engine limitation.
And not that I object per se to ladders, but when was the last time you climbed a ladder in real life? I haven’t in quite some years. I mean, sure, it’s one more interaction, and IIRC there are some fire escapes that had ladders somewhere in Fallout 4 in Boston. But you could make the same argument about interacting with all kinds of things, and it just seems odd for so many people here to mention specifically climbing ladders. I mean, you could fall and catch yourself, drive vehicles, rappel on a rope, skateboard, ice skate, grapple with enemies, zipline, sail a sailing boat, or God knows, any number of other player-object interaction functionality things that might be added. I suppose that any of them could theoretically add gameplay, but I don’t see why the criticality of ladders.
New engine? Do you mean the “Creation Engine 2”, which is still gamebryo at its core? I’m not complaining though because the engine is very mod friendly, it’s just realism is not its strong suit.
It’s interesting how little evolving and upgrading Bethesda does with their stuff. You can’t say that RDR2 and that table tennis game feels the same, but Oblivion and Fallout 4 feel very similar.
It’s a Bethesda problem, because other Gamebryo games don’t feel the same. Even CAVE did a better job with it.
It absolutely is the fault of the engine, but that’s not because Bethesda is incompetent or anything. It’s actually a pretty complicated issue, but yes, it is due to the engine. I wrote a whole explanation for someone else who was parroting the “it’s not the engine’s fault” bs that Pete Hines & Todd Howard started perpetuating a few years ago, so I’ll put it here for you and anyone else:
The problem isn’t the engine itself, it’s that Bethesda hasn’t given it the attention it needs.
Unreal Engine 5, for example, is built from the original Unreal Engine. But there has been so much work put into it that it’s nearly impossible to tell. Meanwhile, the creation engine literally has some of the same issues that the Gambryo engine had back during Morrowind.
To Bethesda’s credit, this isn’t entirely their fault. There’s a reason that proprietary engines have been dying out in favor of engines like Unreal, and that’s because maintaining and improving game engines is incredibly time consuming and expensive. And unless you’re directly profiting off of your engine, like Epic does, you don’t have a massive incentive to endlessly polish it. Doing so is time you could be spending working on your next game, which you do directly profit off of.
Personally, I want Bethesda to keep using the Creation Engine, or whatever they turn it into next, because of its incredible mod support. However, it’s nowhere near as polished or advanced as other engines, and understandably probably never will be. There’s really no easy solution imo.
Absolutely loving it. 25 hours in and a lot more to come, and I’ve barely scratched the surface of the game. I’ve already got a second play through on the mind.
I’m having a great time, but I also love FO4 and No Man’s Sky. The toe-dip I’ve done into colony building shows that they put real thought into Astroneer-like automated manufacturing stuff, which is my crack, and something I missed in NMS and FO4. It’s also clear from the first city that they know how depressing FO4 is, and wanted to add more variety.
Story and characters are a cut above any other Bethesda game so far, but that’s not saying much. My wife is replaying BG3 next to me, and it makes Starfield’s writing look amateurish by comparison. It’s not the core of the game though, so eh.
Downsides so far have been that the minor planets/moons don’t have much to do, and that inventory management is annoying with how much crafting components weigh.
Ship combat is… Fine. It’s not as intricate as Elite: Dangerous or SW:Squadrons (for sim gamers, weapons are all on REALLY forgiving gimbals, which makes precision unnecessary), but not actively bad like NMS VR. I think it’s a good compromise, because not everyone wants to deal with a realistic sim in what is essentially a minigame.
It’s also complex, which is good, but adds some awkwardness to the beginning.
I think they made the right call too. It’s better for almost everyone. A lot of flight sim types are also techies, so I bet the mods will bias that way.
I like it. Still has some classic glitches, enemies jumping high into the air after you kill them, grabbing weapons out of a locked container because part of the gun was sticking was sticking out, you know, Bethesda things.
I found that it looks really blurry if I don’t have it on Ultra settings, that’s my only real complaint.
You might want to check the FSR scaling if the screen looks blurry below ultra. Basically the graphics preset also changes the resolution scaling IIRC with Ultra with the highest percentage.
Also even on low, with fsr up, I’m pulling a whopping 30 fps max with my 1070. My 3060 is dead and I just went ahead and upgraded ahead of the warranty check.
But I had to turn motion blur and film grain back on to make the game even marginally playable. It’s like a new record for how unoptimized it is. Seems specific to nvidia cards.
Turn on FSR but keep the resolution scale at 100% if you don’t want it doing any upscaling. This looks a lot sharper to me than native resolution with no FSR.
I wonder if this is because the TAA implementation lacks a sharpening pass.
However, the graphics are getting kinda long in the tooth.
And it is significantly less-stable. I’ve definitely fallen out of the map a number of times, too.
And without hitting a wiki, you can lock yourself out of a lot of things that aren’t obvious. Choices matter, but often in not-immediately-apparent ways.
If you liked Fallout 1 and Fallout 2, have you tried the Wasteland series? It’s what Fallout 1 was modeled on, and that series kept going.
It’s not Fallout, but it’s the closest I have found to “more Fallout 1 and Fallout 2”.
That being said, I thought that the Fallout jump to 3D would not work well, and I think I was very much wrong there – the series did a pretty good job jumping the gap.
feels like Fallout
If you like the desert American Southwest “New Old West” theme in Fallout 1 and 2 and New Vegas, the Wasteland series does that.
Oh yeah! I was all-in on the Wasteland 2 Kickstarter and bagged the CE of Wasteland 3. Those do scratch the itch a bit, but Fallout’s universe is so much more interesting and weird. Wasteland is a lot more straight-laced, comparatively.
I’m fine with the visual presentation of Bethesda’s Fallout games, but I hate the gameplay. Fallout was the ultimate exercise in player agency and consequences… so many different ways to approach situations with so many possible outcomes. It’s not just shooting things. While New Vegas flirts with those principles, BG3 is the first game in 20 years to REALLY recapture that magic for me. That’s the kind of game I want more of, and that’s the kind of game I want Fallout to be.
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So far I’m a few hours in and I’ve been having a great time. My hardware is closer to the minimum requirements, so I’ve had some issues with my resolution throttling back to keep framerate up in the busiest areas. So far, no significant bugs experienced, assuming the aforementioned texture resolution fuzzing was intentional.
I will say I’ve found all the complaints about loading screens to be a little silly. Again, I’m closer to the minimum hardware level on PC but most loading screens I encounter have been around 3-5 seconds, and they’re generally made up for with other conveniences like the ability, when planetside, to fast travel not just directly to your ship, but Into the pilot’s seat, so I’m spending a lot less time loading than I would have just walking through doors.
All in all so far it feels like exactly what I was expecting.
specifically to the loading screens point, I guess it’s about expectations. Since this is such a huge game advertised as exploration-based people might find too many loading screens immersion-breaking.
I know I’m spoiled about this since Red Dead 2
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It’s amazing how many people aren’t getting this joke.
sigh I know they’re describing Mario, but what am I missing here?
Oh my god… I get it now, thanks ⭐
Maybe it’s an age thing…
Probably were in the wrong camp, had a Sega Master System or Genesis or something at the time.
everything is an age thing, the older you are
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Wow, very surprising. Dunkey already gave it game of the year.
He gave it to which game?
SUPA MARIO BROTHAS 3
God I was about to downvote you because of the spaceship comment. Like “Damn, some guy literally gives you his spaceship and puts you into the combat tutorial in the first 30 minutes.”
I love the comments that arent getting the joke, though.
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If you retry character creation with the second controller expansion pack, you can get a green suit.
Not gonna lie, you had me in the first half lol
I see exactly what I expected. I didn’t bought the hysteria on Youtube/insta/TK.
And I didn’t preorder the game because of that hysteria. The Hysteria looked a lot like the Cyberpunk Fiasco. Realistic expectations, we seem to have lost that capability with upcoming video games. When something sounds too good, It is.
I don’t know what you saw Todd say where but I just read some interviews like this one: https://www.ign.com/articles/todd-howard-interview-starfield-sgf-2023 And in nothing i’ve red from him even slightly resembles the hype around this game.
TH: “We do lock it at 30 [FPS], because we want that fidelity, we want all that stuff.”
That means 1 thing: not a real action game, more in line of FO4, maybe NMS like but more like RDR. A dogfight @30FPS is over before it starts. Beauty is more important then speed for this game.
Speaking about RDR, TH: “So I think it also as a flow, probably has more of a feeling of a [Red Dead Redemption 2]”
Here you have it literally: a game like RDR. Not NMS. Not Elite. Not StarCitizen. But like RDR. That means that the ships are more of a means of transport then a real gameplay mechanic. And space is just the theme.
TH: “this is like five or six games in one, right? It’s the spaceship game, it’s the on the ground game, it’s just a dialogue game, it’s an outpost game, it’s a crafted game. It does all of these things, and so… And it always is tricky for us to get a good game flow where those things don’t feel like they’re separate game”
That means the spaceship part is not front and center. All these things he states are just pieces for a standard RPG:
Add to that it’s build with the Bethesda engine. We know it’s capabilities for what… 2 decades? We flew in FO4. But we didn’t steer… It was on rails
This all meant in my mind that the spaceship part had to be a transportation mini game.
So reading the official stuff, I always expected a mix between FO4 and Mass Effect. With a mobile “base” (your ship) with maybe some light spaceship combat. Sprinkled with some exploration.
Not a game which morphed all those separate game types. Just an FP/3rd p ARPG set in a cool science fiction universe.
I think we’re finally getting Firefly.
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Woosh
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The standard editing that comes with gamepass officially releases 9/6 in the US but due to timezones could be playable 9/5 in the evening. So it could only be a couple more days for the general release assuming you are in the US.
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I7-11/3070/32GB and I have been having a lot of fun. I play all games on very hard and this one I was thinking maybe I should tone it down. I didn’t and I didn’t regret it.
30+ hours in and after reading this thread I feel like some people just got unlucky or were expecting something like SC or SpaceBourne 2. This isn’t those games and weren’t promised to be. I play both of those games and SC is a mess 12 years and $600k later and SB2 is awesome and only made by one guy! But this game is way polished and ready by comparison. By far imo.
I was maybe 4 hours in and got sidetracked in a solar system surveying everything. I forgot about the original quest to scan a moon and just traveled to every planet and not only had a great time scanning and scouting across different moons and planets but was also helping randoms with distress calls and 3 on 1 battles against Spacers in spaceships. By the time I was done with that solar system I was 18 hours in.
I would scan a planet, find a spot to land and drop in. Scout every place that popped up and then set another course on the same planet and repeat. Never did I feel bored or that I was going to see the same assets. Every spot felt unique and well designed. One planet felt like the American Southwest, it was so beautiful.
I highjacked a landed vessel during my surveying mission and upgraded and redesigned it for more maneuverability and storage and I have to say that the ship editor is so well done. I have 1000+ hours in FO76 and the camp building in that was really great and Bethesda has made the industry standard camp building format in SC. It is really an improvement from FO4 to current. I cannot wait until the mods really open this masterpiece up.
I haven’t even touched the base building yet btw.
The space combat is solid. From what I gather people don’t really know how to do space combat. Especially when in bulk freight ships or similar. You have to boost right at them guns blazing and then hard turn when you pass them so you can get behind them. Watch your throttle as you will only turn fast when it’s at halfway (within the white lines). I can take on 3 Spacer attackers on very hard difficulty with this method. If you can track the enemy (perk i think?) do it and just kill their shields and weapons. If you just kill their engines they love to just tumble in space and shoot at you. I usually kill two and then disable the third and board. It’s hard af and fun af.
I would like to be able to spacewalk but also see why it’s not included in Starfield. It’s fun but as I have experienced it in SC all of that extra functionality doesn’t really add to the game. It’s a pain to get out of your ship and fly over to the enemy ship and then try to gain access. I like the way Bethesda did it. Super easy.
Also the space travel is super easy. Fast traveling is great and keeps the game going without having problems finding where you want to go. SC has this problem. Their map of one solar system is terrible and doesn’t work half of the time. It’s only 1 solar system and barely works. Not to mention the navigation in SC and SB2 typically bug out and don’t work which calls for a reboot. Bethesda said fuck that and did better. Sure it’s not as immersive but immersion really has potential to take away from the game and progress.
The overall look and feel is what I was hoping in FO76. Vast improvement. The gunplay is on par with what I want and expect. Fighting on moon bases is fucking awesome. On very hard the enemies are harder, their tactics are okay, not great, but challenging enough to keep you guessing. Abandoned bases are always fun to attack. Loot is everywhere.
Some NPCs are bugged. It’s annoying but infrequent enough to not be a game breaker. The NPCs just talking to you randomly is weird, especially when you are walking through a city and your companion is already talking to you. Needs work.
I caught Shrouds stream and it looks like this game just gets better. I can’t wait to jump back in.
Thanks for the actual good comment and not the circlejerk hate comments that are surrounding this game
I’ll let you know in 2 years when it is on sale for at least 50% off.
Hello, fellow patient gamer!
Enjoy waiting!
Thanks. I might look into the endless things from 2+ years ago that are on sale now. Probably not though. Too many books to read. 😵💫
Throw some good books my way! I’m always on the lookout
Hyperion+Endymion by Dan Simmons. Such a wonderfully written book that evokes so many sad feelings.
It’s veeeery slow (basically the entire first book is build up for the second one), but it’s so rewarding watching all the threads come together by the end.
I mean, we were clearly all so patiently holding our respective breath for this absolute genius comment of yours to grace our screens, O’ wisest of asses. What’s a little longer, really?
Oh wisest spender of 60 dollars, you are the light. How will I ever decide to expend that amount over the next 24+ months. Lmao. Get your goofy ass on
You spend less than $60 in two years’ time? Your Internet bill must be the cheapest on the planet. Your grocery expenses must also be next to nothing if you’re surviving on the warmth of your hot air whinging alone . Fascinating.
It’s $120 in Australia, even at 50% off it’s still more than I’d ever spend on a game. Just gonna keep waiting
Just get Game pass for a month, it launches on there in a couple of days time.
Yo HO!
Yeah we pay an 80% markup just for existing and I hate it, but the gaming industry has been dropping quality while simultaneously increasing prices for some time now.
The only games in the last couple years I’ve paid full price for are CP2077, BG3 and Battlebit. Everything else is bought during the sales, usually at a steep discount, where many of these games should be priced by default.
Fuckin corpo dogs, they’ll ruin anything and everything they can to make a buck.
#nopoors
Lmao I only buy games when they’re discounted too and suddenly I have 186 games in my steam library, most of them are still unplayed . I’m not in a hurry to buy more games with such a long backlog.
Being a patient gamer isn’t strictly about money. It’s about not getting caught up in hype and making more calculated decisions. Even so, wanting to pay what you think something is worth is just good practice.
I’m not going to wait two years – though I’m opposed to preordering – but there are other benefits too. Two years down the line:
A bunch of bugs are patched. Even if Starfield is relatively free of bugs, there will be some.
The wikis for the game have been written up. Some obsessive person will have sat down and figured out the quirks of game mechanics and documented them. Understanding stuff like the relative merits of armor-piercing, bleeding, and so forth in Fallout 4 was complicated.
Starfield’s expansion packs will be out.
Mods will be out, and there will probably be some pretty “must have” ones.
You’ll have more hardware oomph to throw at the game, make it smoother/higher res.
What if I told you it’s possible to have money and not want to waste it on dumb shit?
Maybe that’s one of the reasons you have said money?
Holy crap you know I think you might be onto something
and has quite a few decent mods that fix the annoying things like inventory
Mods are the very first thing that turns me off in a game. I want to play a game, not go stack mods on top of mods just to fix the shit the studio didn’t feel like working on.
They are optional you know?
But Cities Skylines 1 is borderline unplayable outside of Steam because the non-steam players can’t use that one third-party traffic mod on the Steam Workshop that fixes the annoying only-one-lane traffic jams the devs did jack shit about until their recently-released sequel
100% true - but if people feel the need to create so many mods, then there are probably lots of things people feel aren’t good enough about the game. I’ll admit my gaming time is limited, so just researching and adding mods could easily take all my time. I mean, fuck, I sold my Warthog HOTAS and went back to a cheap thrusmaster not because I liked the thrustmaster better, but because I was spending more time writing and fixing scripts and updating my bindings than actually playing the game. And every time an update would come out that would break a script I would spend pretty much my entire gaming time budget for a couple weeks just getting it running again. It got to the point where I just didn’t play those games because every patch would change something and something (even something small) would break or be incompatible. I’m kind of over that.
Every game gets modded, the number of mods reflects how easy it is to do, not the need for them.
Sure, just like SkyUI is “optional” for Skyrim.
Sure, you can. But you will gouge your eyes out.
Personally I don’t like SkyUI, I prefer the base game UI. But I have to use it because so many mods require it :(
Yeah I’ll be patiently waiting for SFSE and StarUI before getting the game lol
Both of those are out now if you haven’t noticed yet.
Oh no kidding that’s awesome! I knew SFSE was in the works but hadn’t heard anything about a SkyUI equivalent
DayZ has entered the chat.
Boy oh boy everyone hates inventory limits and tedious management but devs still feel the need to make sure we have a reason to return towns and what not as the excuse.
Like fuck you, give me a better reason than inconveniencing the fuck out of me while I was out in your world having fun.
cough Baldur’s Gate 3 cough. Why impose an inventory limit if I can just send all the loot I’m gunna sell back to camp? And why no quick “send to camp” hotkey?! Right clickin n shiiittt
Man, preach
Inventory limits are a direct nerf to barrelmancy
20 hours in, I really like it… just wish the spaceship stuff worked more like Elite Dangerous
Refunded it. It’s all of the worst portions of Bethesda games put under 1 roof with space added as a flavor.
I beg to differ. It’s the most beautiful of the Bethesda games by far, very immersive without having to have the main character have dialogue (fallout 4). Tons of items, crafting, research, outposts, ships. This game is huge. Absolutely love it.
I’ve played oblivion, skyrim and fallout 3 and 4. While it’s similar engine of game, this game blew it out of the park.
Worst Bethesda game to date. Returned it.
Weak. FO76 was worse.
Both suck terribly.
What I’m learning is that I’m really glad that I told myself I wouldn’t be buying it until it was on sale post-launch to see if it was even worth the sale price
I waited until I could see video of people actually playing the game. I like how it looks. I decided to just purchase the base game, so I haven’t played it yet but I’m okay with waiting va few days. Also I got my Steam key $5 off on Newegg so paid $65. I’ll wait to buy all of the DLC in a bundle sometime down the road and it will give the game new life for another playthrough.
👍
Played for 3 hours yesterday on a 3070, 10700k, 32GB ram. Game runs and looks incredible on high/ultra settings. I haven’t gotten far into the story, but the beginning gets into the action very fast like Skyrim.
The animations and textures make npcs feel more alive than fallout. I made it to the first city area and it looks amazing. It looks like mirrors edge type city in space
What resolution? I’m just a tier below with a 3060Ti + 10600k and a tech review has me worried my 1440p monitor is gonna be a problem.
I don’t want another situation like downtown in Fallout 4 on my last rig where I’m trying to play a FPS with framerate dips all over the place.
1080p, I’ve been too scared to upgrade to a 1440p monitor on the current rig ):
I had those downtown F4 dips too, even at 1080. This game is far from that, it feels much more polished.
I can’t even play F76 to this day without super annoying frame dips
Definitely get a decent 1440p monitor with high refresh rate and GSync and then you are set. If you get it used it probably won’t even be that expensive (that’s how I got mine around 2 years ago).
Monitors last a long time so it’s not something that you will just toss, and a 3070 with 1080p is such a waste imo
Yeahhh, I found a great deal on this monitor but I was a dumbass and didn’t know how bad the down-rez is when running 1080p on a 1440p monitor😅
Other than not being able to use raytracing in CP2077 it hasn’t been a problem, but I’m think I’m going to start running into trouble from this point on. Oh well, I was thinking of getting another monitor for my workflow anyway…
What about the textures? Like, higher texture resolution?
Higher res and more details in the textures. Faces don’t look like they’re one flat texture with the npcs skin tone, for example.
The look of npcs, items, roads, rocks, hills, etc. is way better than even F4/F76.
Watched a streamer play for quite a while and my primary takeaway is that I wish Bethesda would just scrap their engine and start fresh.
It’s got the same stiffness, gliding movement, butt-ugly NPC’s, and just the general feel of 15 year old Bethesda RPGs. I expect I wouldn’t be able to enjoy it for the same reason I struggled with fallout 4.
I respect the sentiment, so no disrespect to it; but in software, there’s often a lot of caution against throwing out too much code.
You often find certain modules and sections of code that really should be thrown out or overhauled. If you can convince the corporation to dedicate time to doing that, it can often, but not always, show its benefits.
Probably a lot of the popular games we still play use some old bases, but replace parts that don’t work well. I think Apex Legends is still technically using Source (HL2), they’ve just done a lot to it so it no longer looks anything like Half Life 2.
Okay but Bethesdas engine kinda sucks and source engine is still pretty good… Why keep something if it’s not very good, other than to save money of course.
I’m done paying anything above half off a Bethesda games since fallout 4/76 anyway, they were bad and awful.
we’ve never seen a source game at the scale of oblivion and have object permanence so you can’t really compare the two.
It is a new engine for this game.
It’s like arguing the UE5 isn’t new since it’s an upgrade UE4.
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Yes… that’s how engines work unless you rewrite them……
They’ve been saying a new engine for a long time. It’s just not. they change subsystems, but people are saying they can feel the morrowind in their latest titles.
I can’t feel the unreal 1 in UE5 games.
Yeah it’s really weird to feel it again in a game. Especially coming from baldurs gate 3 where the npc interactions and realness of characters is so good
To be thrown into npc dialogue straight at you with no natural movement.
Otherwise the game is really cool so far. Flight is a little complex but I guess I’ll get used to it. The robot even says it’ll be like second nature soon. Assume he was talking directly to the player
I’ve never understood this argument, most game engines are based on 20+ year old technology and have been updated throughout the years. Can the creation engine be improved upon? Definitely yes, but the engine’s age has almost nothing to do with it.
It also is new, it used the creation engine 2.
It would be like arguing that UE5 isn’t new just because it’s an upgraded UE4.
UE5 doesn’t still have UE2 limitations. Gamebryo still won’t let me climb ladders. It’s clear that UE has been upgraded extensively, while Gamebryo has not.
The one thing Unreal still has bug wise is the fact I can’t place hundreds of actors in a blueprints viewport because it lags like Satan but if I run code that spawns the same amount attached to said actor or drag the same quantity into the level itself it works without issue.
Every engine has its own different limitations.
Not everyone cares about climbing ladders so it may not be something they feel is worth the effort to add to their engine.
To say it hasn’t been updated extensively is frankly insulting and is also fundamentally wrong.
One thing I did want in Fallout 4 that I don’t believe it presently does is dynamic generation of polygons in curves.
The game has environments with kinda curvy surfaces, but aside from the dynamic level of detail models, the engine can’t go throw spare horsepower at generating more polygons to make smoother curves. I think that that’s a good match with long-lived PC games, because people playing it years later on more-powerful hardware can burn their extra cycles on making things pretty.
It’s not vital or anything, just think that if there’s one game where it’d be neat, it’d be Bethesda-type games.
Yeah, they can just append a number to it like unreal does and call it a new engine but that’s not what you actually want. It’s not a matter of a “new engine”, it’s them not investing enough into the existing one to make it feel more modern. I know some things like physics and animations are part of the “bethesda charm” but it stopped being charming after skyrim :P
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Old or not it’s clear it needs a fundamental reworking if the same complaints persist across literal decades.
Their point is that the engine doesn’t show signs of being improved upon during that time and is still stuck feeling like a 20 year old engine.
If you mean just the Creation Engine, that was 2011.
If you trace it back to Gamebryo, then Morrowind was 20 years ago, but I don’t think that one can say that even Skyrim looks much like Morrowind.
Skyrim literally had some of the same exact problems that Morrowind had.
Personally I want them to keep the creation engine, if only for the stellar mod support. But let’s not kid ourselves, it desperately needs an overhaul.
What specific functionality is it that you want?
I listed one feature that I’d like to have (dynamic generation of polygons in curved surfaces), which I do not consider to be a very important limitation in another comment.
But if you strongly feel that the engine imposes constraints, then I’m curious what particular functionality it is that you’re after.
EDIT: Another: I don’t think that the game can generate billboards for player-built structures (so you can see the structures you’ve built in Fallout 4 and Fallout 76 many cells away). I don’t think that that’s actually a fundamental engine limitation – you could probably do it with the existing engine, just that the game doesn’t do it today. Instead, stuff like that is generated via offline map-generation tools. But again, it’s not really a huge deal in either of the above Fallout games.
There’s no specific functionality (except maybe ladders lol) it’s more just the engine as a whole. The fact that certain bugs can be found in all of their games from Morrowind to Fallout 4 is unacceptable imo.
And the fact that someone managed to literally put the world of Fallout 4 into Skyrim, and have it just work seamlessly, really speaks volumes.
I actually wrote an explanation for someone else a while ago, so I’ll put it here if you’re curious:
The problem isn’t the engine itself, it’s that Bethesda hasn’t given it the attention it needs.
Unreal Engine 5, for example, is built from the original Unreal Engine. But there has been so much work put into it that it’s nearly impossible to tell. Meanwhile, the creation engine literally has some of the same issues that the Gambryo engine had back during Morrowind.
To Bethesda’s credit, this isn’t entirely their fault. There’s a reason that proprietary engines have been dying out in favor of engines like Unreal, and that’s because maintaining and improving game engines is incredibly time consuming and expensive. And unless you’re directly profiting off of your engine, like Epic does, you don’t have a massive incentive to endlessly polish it. Doing so is time you could be spending working on your next game, which you do directly profit off of.
Personally, I want Bethesda to keep using the Creation Engine, or whatever they turn it into next, because of its incredible mod support. However, it’s nowhere near as polished or advanced as other engines, and understandably probably never will be. There’s really no easy solution imo.
Modern game engines are extremely complex machines, starting from scratch would take decades because it’s fundermental things like drawing geometry in a 3D space, getting input, memory handling, garbage collection and all that low level stuff that needs to be re-done. Physics requires lots of work, so much infact for a time HAVOK was the go to plugin for most engines (still kinda is) just because of how God damn hard it is to have nice physics and high frame rates (tried to build a physics engine from scratch in C++ and I couldn’t get past the floating point position problem so anything too far away from 0,0,0 would spaz and handling multiple collisions on an object simultaneously caused all sorts of freaky things to happen).
Then when that’s done you still need to write additional tools and plugins so developers can import assets and scripts into the engine plus a level editor for designers to place objects, triggers and all that fun stuff.
After that you can now start making the game.
Bethesda probably rewrote huge chunks of their engine to support larger texture sizes and improve performance across the board for Starfield.
If they do decide to dump it then they’re most likely to use an existing engine like Unreal or Cry rather than build one from scratch.
Personally I believe the reason why they didn’t re-write the character movement is because it would also mean altering way to much stuff on the front end.
A good example would be if I use FunctionGetVelocity in my script to determine if a player is moving and it use to return an int but now it returns a float because of the rewrite, without conversion would mean you’d probably get a crash.
Another example would be AI related. If I use a variable to get a rot data type but now that’s been replaced with a struct that needs to be split to get rot now suddenly you have to touch the code to make it compliant.
Which is why I’m sad that cdpr decided to ditch their red engine. So much work turning a buggy mess engine from Witcher 2 into a beautiful (still buggy) engine in cyberpunk. If only they would at least open source it, or sell it to another studio.
I agree. I really admired their persistence with it and it would be nice to have some actual competition to Unreal.
With nanite, live coding and lumen Unreal is unbeatable at the moment and lots of studios are hiring like crazy for Unreal Engine specialists to try and beat the competition.
If CDPR wants to compete they’ll have to do a ton of work making those tools for designers and artists easy to use (alot more in-house engines still have source 2 hammer editor style toolkits and command line conversion tools which are shit compared to Unreals drag and drop advantage).
Plus Unreal 4/5 was built to be as modular as possible so you can build whatever you want while CDPR engine was built specifically for this genre of games Cyberpunk is in. They definitely could and I see the engine having potential but afraid that’s it’s not flexible enough without serious work.
They’ve never been able to get player models and expression right. I can totally forgive it if you get the same level of open world exploration and interaction we got in New Vegas. I personally can trade quality for depth and interesting gameplay (rimworld and dwarf fortress come to mind in the extremes of this). But it does seem like they struggle to achieve standards that were set even 5 years ago.
Bethesda is a funny company. When they are on it and get it right you end up with some of the best games ever made (Skyrim) but when they’re off it just becomes this jumbled mess that got duct taped together and released at full price (fo76).
I’m hoping this is more of the former but we will see. I suspect the modding community is going to take starfield and turn it into something magical. That ship building engine plus copyrighted space ships from pop culture, sign me up.
I think the hardest thing to do is having complex facial expressions overlapping when characters talk. You could do face capture for every dialog option but that would be a massive task.
In alot of engines characters mouths are controlled by a lip sync system that uses, pitch, tone or text fed dialog to ‘mimic’ words being formed in the mouth. It’s far easier to have that and then having facial expressions as a separate animation layer that’s blended together and triggered based on a enum that’s selected by a script (say a players dialog option says “Your a mean man” and the player selects it, the NPC knows what you selected and in that dialogue option theirs a little enum (it makes more sense if you treat a dialogue option as an object) that contains the facial expression or expressions that are appropriate to use in response).
Full facial animations are used mostly for cutscenes because actors cost money while in game is just the engine trying to move the mouth using code (I know Farcry 5 had this where only the important characters had full facial animations and the rest just flapped their mouths up and down).
Would anyone else be interested in a game that aborts a dedicated “conversation mode” to just have players respond in their normal first person view? Games like Titanfall 2 did that - even though your banter with BT is inconsequential.
It could even lead to some fun “actions not words” moments. Like, a gangster explaining to you “I have the council in my pocket and every gun in the city knows your face. What’re you gonna do about it?” shoots him in the head instead of responding
scrapping their engine is a terrible idea, and folks need to stop repeating it
just shows that you dont know what engines are, do or how they evolve
Careful. The last time I spoke ill of Gamebryo+++++++ I was the subject of a short-lived harassment campaign. Bethesda fans are bizarrely protective of this Frankenstein engine. Get this: you still can’t climb ladders! It’s fucking 2023.
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Their engines have been showing it’s age since Skyrim came out. The fact that they got this far is a testament to their willpower, but man, if they’d change it up it might work out really well for them.
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Please point out where I defended Bethesda? Pointing out facts that coincide with them doesn’t make me defending them.
In my other comments I also talk about issues, but of course people only see what they want….
The engine sucks shit. It is functional and useful and bad.
You mistook me for someone else.
I’ve been playing their games since oblivion, I haven’t played this one yet, but if people are complaining about the engine already then I know there’s a decent chance I’ll air the same grievances.
Though, you’re quick to pull out the grass touching, I must ask, why are you so staunch of a defender of Bethesda? Maybe we both should be touching grass.
Nope, talking in general, and thanks for proving my point as well!
So if you’ve played all their games, you should know exactly what to expect and shouldn’t have any complaints than… you’ve enjoyed the game and engine, if you want something new, don’t buy their products and support their decisions……
Where am I defending Bethesda…? I’m defending facts and truth, I’m adding a little of my own opinion, but that shouldn’t be discouraged. But everything I’ve stated is based on facts, it’s a new engine, yes it has issues, so does every other engine……
I’m also not convinced that ladder-climbing, whether one wants it or not, is a fundamental engine limitation. It might not be in the game, but that doesn’t imply that it’s an engine limitation.
googles
This guy modded climbable ladders into Fallout 4, which seems like a pretty good argument that it’s not an engine limitation.
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/62738
And not that I object per se to ladders, but when was the last time you climbed a ladder in real life? I haven’t in quite some years. I mean, sure, it’s one more interaction, and IIRC there are some fire escapes that had ladders somewhere in Fallout 4 in Boston. But you could make the same argument about interacting with all kinds of things, and it just seems odd for so many people here to mention specifically climbing ladders. I mean, you could fall and catch yourself, drive vehicles, rappel on a rope, skateboard, ice skate, grapple with enemies, zipline, sail a sailing boat, or God knows, any number of other player-object interaction functionality things that might be added. I suppose that any of them could theoretically add gameplay, but I don’t see why the criticality of ladders.
Because it gives people something to whine about, literally it.
If it wasn’t ladders, it would be ropes that you clip through instead of tight walking.
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Defending truth and facts is a hill everyone should die on, comparing about immersion breaking ladders… well that’s a very strange one…
But thank you for adding to the conversation? You didn’t really, but hey you tried and maybe that’s all that matters…?
Something about how luminescent their eyes are bothers me. But their engine is starting to show it’s age, that’s for sure.
This is their first game on this new engine, so that’s probably not it.
Calling Creation 2 a “new engine” is a little too generous.
It’s an upgrade of their previous engine, which was an upgrade to gamebryo.
Taking a Model T, and dropping the engine into a Porsche doesn’t mean you have a Porsche.
valves new games are still running off code from gold source
‘engine old’ means extremely little and i wish people would stop parroting it
New engine? Do you mean the “Creation Engine 2”, which is still gamebryo at its core? I’m not complaining though because the engine is very mod friendly, it’s just realism is not its strong suit.
RDR2 was built on RAGE, an engine originally used for a table tennis game. Things get upgraded and evolve.
It’s interesting how little evolving and upgrading Bethesda does with their stuff. You can’t say that RDR2 and that table tennis game feels the same, but Oblivion and Fallout 4 feel very similar.
It’s a Bethesda problem, because other Gamebryo games don’t feel the same. Even CAVE did a better job with it.
Yep, people love to blame the engine but that’s not why their games have the same feel.
It absolutely is the fault of the engine, but that’s not because Bethesda is incompetent or anything. It’s actually a pretty complicated issue, but yes, it is due to the engine. I wrote a whole explanation for someone else who was parroting the “it’s not the engine’s fault” bs that Pete Hines & Todd Howard started perpetuating a few years ago, so I’ll put it here for you and anyone else:
The problem isn’t the engine itself, it’s that Bethesda hasn’t given it the attention it needs.
Unreal Engine 5, for example, is built from the original Unreal Engine. But there has been so much work put into it that it’s nearly impossible to tell. Meanwhile, the creation engine literally has some of the same issues that the Gambryo engine had back during Morrowind.
To Bethesda’s credit, this isn’t entirely their fault. There’s a reason that proprietary engines have been dying out in favor of engines like Unreal, and that’s because maintaining and improving game engines is incredibly time consuming and expensive. And unless you’re directly profiting off of your engine, like Epic does, you don’t have a massive incentive to endlessly polish it. Doing so is time you could be spending working on your next game, which you do directly profit off of.
Personally, I want Bethesda to keep using the Creation Engine, or whatever they turn it into next, because of its incredible mod support. However, it’s nowhere near as polished or advanced as other engines, and understandably probably never will be. There’s really no easy solution imo.
From ping-pong balls to dynamically-resizing horse balls.
Bethesda really needs to tweak their subsurface scattering for the skin and eyeballs (maybe have a separate render method of eye scatter)
Absolutely loving it. 25 hours in and a lot more to come, and I’ve barely scratched the surface of the game. I’ve already got a second play through on the mind.
This is me. Starfield, warts and all, is more engrossing than anything else I’ve played this year.
I have the feeling this is another Bethesda puddle game. So big, but so shallow.
I’m having a great time, but I also love FO4 and No Man’s Sky. The toe-dip I’ve done into colony building shows that they put real thought into Astroneer-like automated manufacturing stuff, which is my crack, and something I missed in NMS and FO4. It’s also clear from the first city that they know how depressing FO4 is, and wanted to add more variety.
Story and characters are a cut above any other Bethesda game so far, but that’s not saying much. My wife is replaying BG3 next to me, and it makes Starfield’s writing look amateurish by comparison. It’s not the core of the game though, so eh.
Downsides so far have been that the minor planets/moons don’t have much to do, and that inventory management is annoying with how much crafting components weigh.
Ship combat is… Fine. It’s not as intricate as Elite: Dangerous or SW:Squadrons (for sim gamers, weapons are all on REALLY forgiving gimbals, which makes precision unnecessary), but not actively bad like NMS VR. I think it’s a good compromise, because not everyone wants to deal with a realistic sim in what is essentially a minigame.
It’s also complex, which is good, but adds some awkwardness to the beginning.
if ship combat was like those space combat games i would be avoiding any space fight like the plague. i barely survived the tutorial enemies 😂
I think they made the right call too. It’s better for almost everyone. A lot of flight sim types are also techies, so I bet the mods will bias that way.
that’s what I’m hoping is a big flight Sim guy
I like it. Still has some classic glitches, enemies jumping high into the air after you kill them, grabbing weapons out of a locked container because part of the gun was sticking was sticking out, you know, Bethesda things.
I found that it looks really blurry if I don’t have it on Ultra settings, that’s my only real complaint.
You might want to check the FSR scaling if the screen looks blurry below ultra. Basically the graphics preset also changes the resolution scaling IIRC with Ultra with the highest percentage.
It took me a hot minute to figure this out.
Also even on low, with fsr up, I’m pulling a whopping 30 fps max with my 1070. My 3060 is dead and I just went ahead and upgraded ahead of the warranty check.
But I had to turn motion blur and film grain back on to make the game even marginally playable. It’s like a new record for how unoptimized it is. Seems specific to nvidia cards.
Turn on FSR but keep the resolution scale at 100% if you don’t want it doing any upscaling. This looks a lot sharper to me than native resolution with no FSR.
I wonder if this is because the TAA implementation lacks a sharpening pass.
I still haven’t completed Skyrim. or New Vegas. or FO4… I’ll be back once those are finished!
New Vegas is a blast. I went in blind after playing Fallout 4 and was blown away by how good the story was compared to Fallout 4.
The New Vegas dialog system is much better.
However, the graphics are getting kinda long in the tooth.
And it is significantly less-stable. I’ve definitely fallen out of the map a number of times, too.
And without hitting a wiki, you can lock yourself out of a lot of things that aren’t obvious. Choices matter, but often in not-immediately-apparent ways.
I tried to play it on release, but it was so buggy I couldn’t continue. I’m looking forward to seeing what I missed out on
New Vegas is the only post-Interplay Fallout game that actually feels like Fallout. It would be nice to get a remaster, though… it’s not aging well.
If you liked Fallout 1 and Fallout 2, have you tried the Wasteland series? It’s what Fallout 1 was modeled on, and that series kept going.
It’s not Fallout, but it’s the closest I have found to “more Fallout 1 and Fallout 2”.
That being said, I thought that the Fallout jump to 3D would not work well, and I think I was very much wrong there – the series did a pretty good job jumping the gap.
If you like the desert American Southwest “New Old West” theme in Fallout 1 and 2 and New Vegas, the Wasteland series does that.
Oh yeah! I was all-in on the Wasteland 2 Kickstarter and bagged the CE of Wasteland 3. Those do scratch the itch a bit, but Fallout’s universe is so much more interesting and weird. Wasteland is a lot more straight-laced, comparatively.
I’m fine with the visual presentation of Bethesda’s Fallout games, but I hate the gameplay. Fallout was the ultimate exercise in player agency and consequences… so many different ways to approach situations with so many possible outcomes. It’s not just shooting things. While New Vegas flirts with those principles, BG3 is the first game in 20 years to REALLY recapture that magic for me. That’s the kind of game I want more of, and that’s the kind of game I want Fallout to be.
Ah, I gotcha, yeah, I guess I can see that.
Yeah, from that standpoint, I imagine that Fallout 76 must have been a complete disappointment, because that element is almost nonexistent there.
You ever play Jagged Alliance 2? It’s pretty old now, got more of a combat focus, but has a lot of the “multiple ways to pull things off”.
I played it on the steam deck this year and it was great! I completed 1, 2 and Tactics all on the deck.
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