"If you're not happy using the tools available to you to improve frame rate and you're not happy with the frame rate you have, you should play a different game"
That would be comical. Breaking the 4th wall, boss talking shit. Get a refund punk you suck at this, while you’re at it throw your PC in a lake, fish play better.
Oh, Sans is smarter than that; he’d say how you can’t refund because you’ve already played for way more than 2 hours to get this far. If anything, he would mention your actual playtime statistic in his dialogue.
To make it perfect, the boss should appear right after the two hour mark is met, so you actually can’t. The boss should also use that material. Modern day metal gear solid is they also manage to pull user owned games and game data from steam API or something.
They care because people that haven’t bought it should know that these issues don’t seem to be getting better. They should know that their money would be going to that asshole’s pockets. This shit matters and you wanting to plug your ears to discomfort doesn’t change that.
I don’t get it. Borderlands 1 ran at like 720p (less?) on native hardware (Xbox 360) and it looked great, mostly because of the cel-shaded graphics. Cel-shaded was code (maybe still is) for low-res and it covers it up well. So I feel like anyone trying to push 4K Borderlands (Gearbox, or players) is in the wrong here and that may be part of the problem. Now if Borderlands 4 can’t run at 1080p or 1440p on good hardware… that’s Gearbox’s problem to fix. Trying to run Borderlands at 4K sounds about as stupid to me as Animal Crossing at 8K — apparently that has been accomplished with a very powerful computer and an emulator. (AC for Switch is not performance locked to hardware, it’ll scale up to whatever you can run it on.) But it just begs the question “fucking WHY?”.
I feel like the discourse around Borderlands 4 should be “is it fun” followed at a great distance by “is the story compelling enough to draw me in?” I did not have plot expectations for the first one, and it exceeded them.
Disclaimer: played and beat BL1 and all its DLC. Dabbled in 2 and 3. Have not played BL4 yet. Looking forward to a Siren play on my Series X at some point, but not now.
Trying to run Borderlands at 4K sounds about as stupid to me as…
On the contrary, it should be perfectly runnable at 4K because its a 2025 FPS game and the cel-shaded graphics should be easy to render.
‘Unreal Engine’ is no excuse either. Try something like Satisfactory rendering literally thousands of dynamic machines on a shoestring budget with Lumen, like butter, on 2020 GPUs, and tell me that’s a sluggish engine.
This is on Gearbox, who’ve developed on Unreal for 2 decades. And ‘sorry, we’ll work on it’ would have been a fine response…
Honestly Cyberpunk’s raytracing runs like poo compared to Lumen (or KCD2 Crytek) compared to how good it looks. I don’t like any of the RT effects but RT Reflections; both RT shadows options flicker, RT lighting conflicts with the baked-in lighting, yet doesn’t replace it if you mod it out.
Most of Cyberpunk’s prettiness is there from good old rastarization, more than most people realize.
PTGI looks incredible, but it’s basically only usable with mods and a 4090+.
Eh, I guess it is. But it also isn’t. We have stagnated a bit in the rasterization and VRAM departments when you talk about affordable entry level cards that most people buy.
And the PlayStation 5 has not changed since it launched…
Sure, newer cards have Ray Tracing stuff and new video encoder pipelines and some other things. But when you look at classic rasterization, and look at xx60 and xx70 class cards, it’s not the sort of leaps we use to have. Node shrinks are not what they use to be.
A 3060 is as fast as a 2070 super. Just as an example I have first hand experience with. There use to be much larger performance gaps between generations.
Yeah, but it’s not just a toon shader/cel shaded shader.
I’ve seen footage, this game has full (highly stylized) PBR and all sorts of fancy lighting along with the cell shaded look. Reducing it all to “cell shading” isn’t the whole story.
Hi-Fi Rush is much closer to classic Borderlands than BL4 is.
Right, I’ve seen the footage too, and I don’t think I’d recognize it as a Borderlands game if the name wasn’t included in the ads. I’m struggling to understand why they chose to go that route, rather than sticking to the beloved, iconic, performant art style of the other games in the series.
My understanding is that Unreal is a garbage engine for optimization at face value, it has a lot of useful tools and a lot of incorrect/dated documentation for those tools some of which are also just kind of configured wrong as their default settings. If effort is put into optimization to configure things correctly and only use the various tools like nanite or lumen in their actual use cases (rather than just throwing them on everything) you can get some pretty fantastic optimization.
TLDR: Good but complex tools marketed as low effort with bad defaults and exagerated marketing.
This guy is why PR consultants and Social Media teams exist. Some people just should not have contact with the public. However good he might or might not be in his work on the project itself, someone should have told him to sit down and shut up and let someone who knows how not to damage the entire game with a single statement handle the communication.
“There’s no such thing as bad press” is such a dogshit saying that is demonstrably untrue. There is absolutely bad press, just because we’re talking about it doesn’t mean it’s good for the product. For every one schmuck who thinks they’ll buy Borderlands 4 just to prove how good their computer is, there’s a hundred people who have decided never to buy it at all and half if them have written off gearbox entirely.
I generally have nothing but a deep sense of loathing for marketing, but I genuinely feel bad for the people who have to try smearing lipstick on this pig.
I’m not much of a fan of the series, but the complaints I’m seeing are in the “I only get 30fps instead of 60fps on ultra!” kinds of things that make me roll my eyes super hard
The eye rolling would be justified if the 30FPS was on something like a 3070 or something like that, but when the complaint comes from someone sporting a 5090, well…
If the game runs at 30FPS on the latest, greatest top-of-the-line card from Nvidia, imagine what kind of performance people are getting from 4060s or RX6600s…
A game that’s this badly optimised is a disrespect to all gamers.
Is that what the situation is? I think that’s also only the case on 4k with brutal mode enabled or whatever.
Obviously that’s still not great if so, but I’d still put it in the eyeroll category personally. I don’t really feel butthurt if I have to run at 1080p or enable vlss or not get 120fps or whatever, especially on day 1 for a game.
But I come from an era where there were games you had to shrink some 3d games lower than 320x200 to get a playable 10fps, so I’m also probably feeling some “back in my day we walked uphill both ways - kids today” energy here. What do I know.
You had the luxury of 320x200 ? What were you playing on, a Cray Supercomputer ? /s
The thing is, we keep being bombarded by promises of how spectacular and wonderful New Game X will be, just to be punched in the face by stuff that falls short of that. This emotional roller coaster has actual costs, not only in terms of money, but also mental and emotional health. Is the reason why some countries, like mine (Brazil), have consumer protection laws that explicitly prohibits misleading advertising. And yes, showing a beautiful demo on a trade show counts, to then deliver a half-assed product falls squarely on the misleading advertisement category. This means people (at least here) can expect a certain level of performance and polish from games, this being backed by law.
Basically, is not about feeling entitled, is about ensuring our rights as consumers are not trampled by devs.
Borderlands really didnt deserve another chance after the shit games theyve released but it seems people fell for.the marketing and gave it one anyway. Now the same thing is happening the game is shit and was sold at a ridiculous price and while you’re sitting there trying to scrap together some enjoyment youve got this asshole Randy hitting headlines daily.
Man I don’t know how the board of directors is going to feel about the CEO telling people to refund their game. That seems like it would be on the list of things you don’t want your CEO telling people.
So it’s been reported that the PS 5 suffers from performance issues, especially during long play periods due to being perfectly optimized and this is his latest response:
“Known issue of perf dropping on PS5 pro after several hours of continuous play,” he said. “Workaround until we patch: Quit game and restart. Sorry for the friction!”
I mean, he’s an airheaded out-of-touch fellow-kids piece of shit, but he’s not entirely wrong about restarting a game if it starts getting fucky after several hours of continuous play.
Also, I’d suggest to just about anyone that they should probably at least get up and walk around, maybe get some fresh air, if you’re gonna be gaming all day. Your devices need breaks too.
Honestly for a new game three or for hours sessions on a game like this is pretty normal and people are saying that it’s a constant drop in performance after just an hour or two and continues to get worse until your running like your in a 1070.
And no these consoles and computers are not expected to need a break after just a two hours of running, that’s not how good applications work.
The only games I know of that need to restart every once in awhile are Paradox games and ultra modded Bethesda games. Paradox because sometimes the game needs a restart to let the AI reprioritize and for Bethesda it’s because of memory leaks that become a problem after too many mods. The fact that Borderlands 4 is that bad out of the box is fucking sad.
New Vegas is a cranky bitch and is either the most stable game to ever exist or it CTDs when you look at the big horner funny. It becomes more stable as you mod it.
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: [email protected]
Welcome to the largest gaming community on Lemmy! Discussion for all kinds of games. Video games, tabletop games, card games etc.
Rules
1. Submissions have to be related to games
Video games, tabletop, or otherwise. Posts not related to games will be deleted.
This community is focused on games, of all kinds. Any news item or discussion should be related to gaming in some way.
2. No bigotry or harassment, be civil
No bigotry, hardline stance. Try not to get too heated when entering into a discussion or debate.
We are here to talk and discuss about one of our passions, not fight or be exposed to hate. Posts or responses that are hateful will be deleted to keep the atmosphere good. If repeatedly violated, not only will the comment be deleted but a ban will be handed out as well. We judge each case individually.
3. No excessive self-promotion
Try to keep it to 10% self-promotion / 90% other stuff in your post history.
This is to prevent people from posting for the sole purpose of promoting their own website or social media account.
4. Stay on-topic; no memes, funny videos, giveaways, reposts, or low-effort posts
This community is mostly for discussion and news. Remember to search for the thing you’re submitting before posting to see if it’s already been posted.
We want to keep the quality of posts high. Therefore, memes, funny videos, low-effort posts and reposts are not allowed. We prohibit giveaways because we cannot be sure that the person holding the giveaway will actually do what they promise.
5. Mark Spoilers and NSFW
Make sure to mark your stuff or it may be removed.
No one wants to be spoiled. Therefore, always mark spoilers. Similarly mark NSFW, in case anyone is browsing in a public space or at work.
6. No linking to piracy
Don’t share it here, there are other places to find it. Discussion of piracy is fine.
We don’t want us moderators or the admins of lemmy.world to get in trouble for linking to piracy. Therefore, any link to piracy will be removed. Discussion of it is of course allowed.
[Gabe Dislike That]
I literally thought an in game boss was telling you to get a refund
That would be comical. Breaking the 4th wall, boss talking shit. Get a refund punk you suck at this, while you’re at it throw your PC in a lake, fish play better.
Dude that’s some serious Sans stuff
The games called Serious Sam.
Oh, Sans is smarter than that; he’d say how you can’t refund because you’ve already played for way more than 2 hours to get this far. If anything, he would mention your actual playtime statistic in his dialogue.
To make it perfect, the boss should appear right after the two hour mark is met, so you actually can’t. The boss should also use that material. Modern day metal gear solid is they also manage to pull user owned games and game data from steam API or something.
Seems like the kind of guy I’d want in charge of my company. “Don’t buy my stuff” is some next level 4D marketing.
He probally knows only a certain percentage of his audience will ever hear about this.
He’s right. Refund it and don’t bother supporting him again. Simple!
I disagree. Don’t buy it to begin with lol
Exactly. I don’t get why people even cares about what this dude is saying. Dont like the game? Refund it ffs.
They care because people that haven’t bought it should know that these issues don’t seem to be getting better. They should know that their money would be going to that asshole’s pockets. This shit matters and you wanting to plug your ears to discomfort doesn’t change that.
Overrated franchise has dogshit legacy sequel. More news at 11.
I don’t get it. Borderlands 1 ran at like 720p (less?) on native hardware (Xbox 360) and it looked great, mostly because of the cel-shaded graphics. Cel-shaded was code (maybe still is) for low-res and it covers it up well. So I feel like anyone trying to push 4K Borderlands (Gearbox, or players) is in the wrong here and that may be part of the problem. Now if Borderlands 4 can’t run at 1080p or 1440p on good hardware… that’s Gearbox’s problem to fix. Trying to run Borderlands at 4K sounds about as stupid to me as Animal Crossing at 8K — apparently that has been accomplished with a very powerful computer and an emulator. (AC for Switch is not performance locked to hardware, it’ll scale up to whatever you can run it on.) But it just begs the question “fucking WHY?”.
I feel like the discourse around Borderlands 4 should be “is it fun” followed at a great distance by “is the story compelling enough to draw me in?” I did not have plot expectations for the first one, and it exceeded them.
Disclaimer: played and beat BL1 and all its DLC. Dabbled in 2 and 3. Have not played BL4 yet. Looking forward to a Siren play on my Series X at some point, but not now.
On the contrary, it should be perfectly runnable at 4K because its a 2025 FPS game and the cel-shaded graphics should be easy to render.
‘Unreal Engine’ is no excuse either. Try something like Satisfactory rendering literally thousands of dynamic machines on a shoestring budget with Lumen, like butter, on 2020 GPUs, and tell me that’s a sluggish engine.
This is on Gearbox, who’ve developed on Unreal for 2 decades. And ‘sorry, we’ll work on it’ would have been a fine response…
Right because Cyberpunk looks amazing in 2025 and it ran like shit five years ago at launch.
But 4K gaming is more demanding than people realise and gaming companies shouldn’t be getting so much flak for it.
Honestly Cyberpunk’s raytracing runs like poo compared to Lumen (or KCD2 Crytek) compared to how good it looks. I don’t like any of the RT effects but RT Reflections; both RT shadows options flicker, RT lighting conflicts with the baked-in lighting, yet doesn’t replace it if you mod it out.
Most of Cyberpunk’s prettiness is there from good old rastarization, more than most people realize.
PTGI looks incredible, but it’s basically only usable with mods and a 4090+.
why are we comparing a game 5 years ago to one released today? hardware is much more capable now.
Eh, I guess it is. But it also isn’t. We have stagnated a bit in the rasterization and VRAM departments when you talk about affordable entry level cards that most people buy.
And the PlayStation 5 has not changed since it launched…
Sure, newer cards have Ray Tracing stuff and new video encoder pipelines and some other things. But when you look at classic rasterization, and look at xx60 and xx70 class cards, it’s not the sort of leaps we use to have. Node shrinks are not what they use to be.
A 3060 is as fast as a 2070 super. Just as an example I have first hand experience with. There use to be much larger performance gaps between generations.
You shouldn’t need leaps in hardware to render a highly stylized cell shaded video game in the year 2025.
Yeah, but it’s not just a toon shader/cel shaded shader.
I’ve seen footage, this game has full (highly stylized) PBR and all sorts of fancy lighting along with the cell shaded look. Reducing it all to “cell shading” isn’t the whole story.
Hi-Fi Rush is much closer to classic Borderlands than BL4 is.
Right, I’ve seen the footage too, and I don’t think I’d recognize it as a Borderlands game if the name wasn’t included in the ads. I’m struggling to understand why they chose to go that route, rather than sticking to the beloved, iconic, performant art style of the other games in the series.
My understanding is that Unreal is a garbage engine for optimization at face value, it has a lot of useful tools and a lot of incorrect/dated documentation for those tools some of which are also just kind of configured wrong as their default settings. If effort is put into optimization to configure things correctly and only use the various tools like nanite or lumen in their actual use cases (rather than just throwing them on everything) you can get some pretty fantastic optimization.
TLDR: Good but complex tools marketed as low effort with bad defaults and exagerated marketing.
Gearbox has developed on Unreal Engine since 2005. They have ~1,300 employees.
I’m sorry, I know game dev is hard. But if small, new studios can get it to work, Gearbox should get it to fly. They have no excuse.
This guy is why PR consultants and Social Media teams exist. Some people just should not have contact with the public. However good he might or might not be in his work on the project itself, someone should have told him to sit down and shut up and let someone who knows how not to damage the entire game with a single statement handle the communication.
Problem is, there’s no such thing as bad press. Here we are talking about it.
“There’s no such thing as bad press” is such a dogshit saying that is demonstrably untrue. There is absolutely bad press, just because we’re talking about it doesn’t mean it’s good for the product. For every one schmuck who thinks they’ll buy Borderlands 4 just to prove how good their computer is, there’s a hundred people who have decided never to buy it at all and half if them have written off gearbox entirely.
Yep, talking about how I will never buy a gearbox game.
I generally have nothing but a deep sense of loathing for marketing, but I genuinely feel bad for the people who have to try smearing lipstick on this pig.
Is it really that bad?
I’m not much of a fan of the series, but the complaints I’m seeing are in the “I only get 30fps instead of 60fps on ultra!” kinds of things that make me roll my eyes super hard
The eye rolling would be justified if the 30FPS was on something like a 3070 or something like that, but when the complaint comes from someone sporting a 5090, well…
If the game runs at 30FPS on the latest, greatest top-of-the-line card from Nvidia, imagine what kind of performance people are getting from 4060s or RX6600s…
A game that’s this badly optimised is a disrespect to all gamers.
Is that what the situation is? I think that’s also only the case on 4k with brutal mode enabled or whatever.
Obviously that’s still not great if so, but I’d still put it in the eyeroll category personally. I don’t really feel butthurt if I have to run at 1080p or enable vlss or not get 120fps or whatever, especially on day 1 for a game.
But I come from an era where there were games you had to shrink some 3d games lower than 320x200 to get a playable 10fps, so I’m also probably feeling some “back in my day we walked uphill both ways - kids today” energy here. What do I know.
You had the luxury of 320x200 ? What were you playing on, a Cray Supercomputer ? /s
The thing is, we keep being bombarded by promises of how spectacular and wonderful New Game X will be, just to be punched in the face by stuff that falls short of that. This emotional roller coaster has actual costs, not only in terms of money, but also mental and emotional health. Is the reason why some countries, like mine (Brazil), have consumer protection laws that explicitly prohibits misleading advertising. And yes, showing a beautiful demo on a trade show counts, to then deliver a half-assed product falls squarely on the misleading advertisement category. This means people (at least here) can expect a certain level of performance and polish from games, this being backed by law.
Basically, is not about feeling entitled, is about ensuring our rights as consumers are not trampled by devs.
Randy has inspired me to purchase the game and immediately refund it. Thanks Randy!
CRASH! SLAMMED! POPPED!
Hey board of directors! Make me your new CEO and I will fix this problem!
Borderlands really didnt deserve another chance after the shit games theyve released but it seems people fell for.the marketing and gave it one anyway. Now the same thing is happening the game is shit and was sold at a ridiculous price and while you’re sitting there trying to scrap together some enjoyment youve got this asshole Randy hitting headlines daily.
Man I don’t know how the board of directors is going to feel about the CEO telling people to refund their game. That seems like it would be on the list of things you don’t want your CEO telling people.
it got the community manager for helldivers 2 fired, so… 🍿
Dude is a never ending source of stupidity.
So it’s been reported that the PS 5 suffers from performance issues, especially during long play periods due to being perfectly optimized and this is his latest response:
I mean, he’s an airheaded out-of-touch fellow-kids piece of shit, but he’s not entirely wrong about restarting a game if it starts getting fucky after several hours of continuous play.
Also, I’d suggest to just about anyone that they should probably at least get up and walk around, maybe get some fresh air, if you’re gonna be gaming all day. Your devices need breaks too.
He’s not wrong, but a game you have to do that to isn’t made very well.
Lol @ devices need breaks too. What an absolute nonsense.
If you’re cold, they’re cold. Bring them inside
Honestly for a new game three or for hours sessions on a game like this is pretty normal and people are saying that it’s a constant drop in performance after just an hour or two and continues to get worse until your running like your in a 1070.
And no these consoles and computers are not expected to need a break after just a two hours of running, that’s not how good applications work.
Devices don’t “need breaks”. This problem is indicative of a memory leak, which means they coded something shitty.
Sure, playing for 7 hours straight is excessive, but this shouldn’t happen.
The only games I know of that need to restart every once in awhile are Paradox games and ultra modded Bethesda games. Paradox because sometimes the game needs a restart to let the AI reprioritize and for Bethesda it’s because of memory leaks that become a problem after too many mods. The fact that Borderlands 4 is that bad out of the box is fucking sad.
Lol “ultra modded”. New Vegas has a mind of it’s own in vanilla.
New Vegas is a cranky bitch and is either the most stable game to ever exist or it CTDs when you look at the big horner funny. It becomes more stable as you mod it.
Damn, that all is Comedy and insanely ridiculous.
People wanted this Game so Bad. They fucked up a bit … and the CEO goes banana. What a sad ending to this