China unveils new laws intended to limit certain practices by gaming companies, leading to some big changes in the nation's gaming market.
These laws will ban rewards for spending money within a game for the first time, ban rewards for buying consecutive microtransactions, and ban rewards for daily log-ins.
I haven’t had a look at the original text from China, but wondering how much they accounted for. Any of these rules could be easily circumvented if they didn’t account for multiple scenarios.
Rewards for spending money within a game for the first time
“We don’t have a reward for spending money for the first time, but everyone does have a digital coupon for $5 off of their first $10 purchase when they make an account.”
Rewards for buying consecutive microtransactions
“The players don’t get any extras when they buy more of our digital currency, but every gacha pull does make the next 5 pulls a bit cheaper.”
Rewards for daily log-ins.
“No, we’re not giving rewards for daily log-ins, but players can buy this bonus that adds a gift-giving NPC to the main town for 30 days, who will trade a small parcel of premium currency for a single gold coin once per day.”
How do Chinese judges react to transparent attempts to circumvent laws that have the same effect as just breaking the law? I wouldn’t expect them to fall for the “I’m not touching you” defense.
That’s not what I’m saying. I was just hoping this law has teeth, because companies who are greedy for money will always try to circumvent whatever new restrictions are sent their way.
I’m thinking back to earlier policies set by China like the restrictions against showing undead/human remains in video games. World of Warcraft set up all these euphemistic workarounds to circumvent the law while realistically changing as little as possible, basically defeating the purpose of it.
China outlawed loot boxes, but then season passes and gatcha models were implemented in short order to continue exploiting consumers. If the law doesn’t account for all sorts of scenarios that can be abused, it’s just going to be a game of cat and mouse.
World of Warcraft set up all these euphemistic workarounds to circumvent the law while realistically changing as little as possible, basically defeating the purpose of it.
The only one I’m aware of is China’s cultural distaste for showing bones, so Blizzard had to hide the skeletal structure in the Undead player class. In other words, it wasn’t about the undead, it was only about showing bones.
Well, it’s China. How the commerce law affect you will depend heavily on who you know in the government and the party. If the new law is heavily pushed by someone important, they probably won’t turn a blind eye for minor technicality. Someone up high probably got mad with their kids getting addicted with microtransactions and want to neuter it. Once that person lost interest or no longer in power, the enforcement will probably become much lenient.
Didn’t China also recently introduce a limit of hours adolescents can game?
The world would be a better place without those transactions in my opinion. It might sound extreme but in my view this is the first step towards gambling addiction.
We as humanity are becoming really obsessed with everything digital instead of spending more time physically interacting with our peers. And unfortunately I am no exception.
Part of the problem is that there’s no incentive for game companies to ensure that players are of an appropriate age and are gambling responsibly. It’s a Pandora’s box of capitalism in the same way fossil fuels, cigarettes, and big pharma are. Their customers have a demand for their product which is driven by a physiological/psychological/socioeconomic need, so they aren’t subject to normal market mechanics.
It’d be nice to see that come to rocket League. You know, the game where they removed crates because of the gambling, then removed trading to get kids to spend more money in the shop. So much better :/
To add onto what the others have said, the CCP isn’t shy about enforcing restrictions on digital media domestically. For instance, TikTok in China (Douyin) is quite different from the international version with strictly-enforced time limits, content restrictions, etc.
But think about the CEO’s freedom of abusing gambling addicts outside of a safe environment with virtually no regulation and that can be used by kids and teens!
I actually wouldn’t have anything against gacha games if they all were marked as Adult-only, even the most dumbass parents would think twice about buying EA FC if it had the AO rating.
If it was only money they wanted they would not do this. The limitations they are imposing will cut revenue to their biggest Game companies. I mean, the laws are not in effect and there was already a big crash on Netease and Tencent stock prices.
China doing a better job regulating corporations than the west is nothing new.
Even this current one happened while Tencent was barely recovering from another regulation set last year. Kicking megacorps while they’re down lol as they should.
Well China doesn’t like companies having power so this is a way to neuter them, especially in response to trying to limit online game consumption already.
Edit: Tencent is apparently the most profitable company in china right now so this is a direct attack at their profits most likely, not just China doing good
I would’ve expected to see something like thus out of the EU rather than China, but at least somebody’s making the first move against the predatory monetisation of apps
The Chinese government has started it‘s witch hunt against video games years ago and we have yet to see any of their draconic laws being enforced. It looks like they made them just so they can cherry pick and suppress whoever disagrees with them one way or another. This will be no exception. Gambling, prostitution and porn are all illegal in mainland China but it has always been a huge and open business in every part of the country.
What’s predatory about this? This seems like the least forced purchase in the world – absolutely nobody needs the things they’re selling. They are like a definition of a luxury item.
Predatory as in they literally employ psychologists to help design them to be as addictive as they can be, then they market it towards kids or at the very least don’t really do anything to prevent kids from gambling in them (yeah it’s also partially a parenting issue but can’t really expect all parents to be tech savvy enough to understand all everything about gaming).
Then there’s the other sucky, but just not sucky enough for it to be an illegal side of things: games that these mechanics suck ass and we are getting less and less objectively good games because more and more games seek to make some quick buck by making their games casinos of sorts.
It’s only as luxurious as being addicted to cocaine in hopes that the next line will hit like the first one, or in game terms, hoping that the next loot box gets you the skin/character/whatever you wanted and releases that quick dopamine rush. Rinse and repeat.
I think the comparison to cocaine is apt. Therefore I find it increasingly odd how parents purchase their children cocaine-delivery mechanisms, and how society deems all this completely legal.
Do you all expect localization is tied to laws for china? I realy don’t think so. Most games are split into global and asia/chinese versions anyway. Why should they remove these mechanics when it isn’t necessary for the market they operate in?
The thought process is that for many games, the majority of their revenue comes from these mechanics and from China. The games themselves will need to change to get revenue flowing. And new games won’t be made with this revenue source in general.
This is similar to how eu regulations can lead to global changes sometimes, China is a big enough market to affect things globally.
Yep, I’m not in the EU but thanks to the GDPR I still see the cookies thing on almost every website I go, sometimes these things have a good ripple effect.
I think you could go two ways with that. The psychologist could be under a mandate to give feedback to ensure your game is not going to be an addiction or they could be under a mandate to make it as addictive as possible. The latter is way more likely but I wouldn’t totally rule out the value add of any psychologist to any game.
You are allowed to completely disagree with leadership and goverment policies and actions and still agree with reasonable restrictions and laws. Course I haven’t looked into this so it could very well go way too far.
Ffs only on lemmy can you get shit on for telling ccp supporters to fuck off, china and russia are just barely worse than the states(also fuck america) for most corrupt shithole countries.
Fuck china and and fuck you, you tankie piece of garbage. Go back to weibo or hexbear where you belong you piece of shit.
I don’t care for ol Winnie and his Thousand Acre Ego, and hate many things China has done. In far too many ways they are backwards, explicitly destructive, and often refuse to negotiate.
However, and likely due to the overreach of government there, they certainly can and do make decisions I can at least agree with. If it wasn’t for the general conniving and “fuck you, I prefer one-way streets” way of essentially absolute control, I’d argue they were the good guys. Problem is we know better. The world isn’t that simple.
I just wish it was.
We’d be so much further along as a race if we could work together.
You are not logged in. However you can subscribe from another Fediverse account, for example Lemmy or Mastodon. To do this, paste the following into the search field of your instance: [email protected]
Welcome to the largest gaming community on Lemmy! Discussion for all kinds of games. Video games, tabletop games, card games etc.
I haven’t had a look at the original text from China, but wondering how much they accounted for. Any of these rules could be easily circumvented if they didn’t account for multiple scenarios.
“We don’t have a reward for spending money for the first time, but everyone does have a digital coupon for $5 off of their first $10 purchase when they make an account.”
“The players don’t get any extras when they buy more of our digital currency, but every gacha pull does make the next 5 pulls a bit cheaper.”
“No, we’re not giving rewards for daily log-ins, but players can buy this bonus that adds a gift-giving NPC to the main town for 30 days, who will trade a small parcel of premium currency for a single gold coin once per day.”
How do Chinese judges react to transparent attempts to circumvent laws that have the same effect as just breaking the law? I wouldn’t expect them to fall for the “I’m not touching you” defense.
I guess we just shouldn’t make any law about anything since people can go “well akshually” about it. /s
That’s not what I’m saying. I was just hoping this law has teeth, because companies who are greedy for money will always try to circumvent whatever new restrictions are sent their way.
I’m thinking back to earlier policies set by China like the restrictions against showing undead/human remains in video games. World of Warcraft set up all these euphemistic workarounds to circumvent the law while realistically changing as little as possible, basically defeating the purpose of it.
China outlawed loot boxes, but then season passes and gatcha models were implemented in short order to continue exploiting consumers. If the law doesn’t account for all sorts of scenarios that can be abused, it’s just going to be a game of cat and mouse.
The only one I’m aware of is China’s cultural distaste for showing bones, so Blizzard had to hide the skeletal structure in the Undead player class. In other words, it wasn’t about the undead, it was only about showing bones.
What else did they do?
Well, it’s China. How the commerce law affect you will depend heavily on who you know in the government and the party. If the new law is heavily pushed by someone important, they probably won’t turn a blind eye for minor technicality. Someone up high probably got mad with their kids getting addicted with microtransactions and want to neuter it. Once that person lost interest or no longer in power, the enforcement will probably become much lenient.
This is China, their CEO will misteriously disappear if they try something so obvious.
deleted by creator
Didn’t China also recently introduce a limit of hours adolescents can game?
The world would be a better place without those transactions in my opinion. It might sound extreme but in my view this is the first step towards gambling addiction.
We as humanity are becoming really obsessed with everything digital instead of spending more time physically interacting with our peers. And unfortunately I am no exception.
Not recently, but yes.
Also, there’s regulation to disclose the probability in getting rewards from opening “chests”, which is actually gambling in nature.
In 2019, it was limited to 90 minutes on weekdays and not between the hours of 10 pm to 8 am.
In 2021, it was changed to 1 hour per day, only on Fridays, weekends, and public holidays.
Part of the problem is that there’s no incentive for game companies to ensure that players are of an appropriate age and are gambling responsibly. It’s a Pandora’s box of capitalism in the same way fossil fuels, cigarettes, and big pharma are. Their customers have a demand for their product which is driven by a physiological/psychological/socioeconomic need, so they aren’t subject to normal market mechanics.
The Chinese government actually does something right for once? My year is saved.
A broken is right sometimss
It’d be nice to see that come to rocket League. You know, the game where they removed crates because of the gambling, then removed trading to get kids to spend more money in the shop. So much better :/
The S$20000 ($15000) Genshin Impact buying spree incident in Singapore had indirectly contributed to proposed legislation.
The what?
A lot of games are starting to display warnings to spend wisely when purchasing premium currency.
Which part of china is Singapore in?
Limiting micro transactions and banning predatory reward schemes in video games is genuinely a good thing. We need this to spread around the world.
Very rare China W.
Very common W
Seriously seeing this come from China is
Mildly confusing, very unexpected but very much a cool move.
To add onto what the others have said, the CCP isn’t shy about enforcing restrictions on digital media domestically. For instance, TikTok in China (Douyin) is quite different from the international version with strictly-enforced time limits, content restrictions, etc.
Yeah im sad China is so far ahead of curbing predative monetization than my own country is, now.
But think about the CEO’s freedom of abusing gambling addicts outside of a safe environment with virtually no regulation and that can be used by kids and teens!
I actually wouldn’t have anything against gacha games if they all were marked as Adult-only, even the most dumbass parents would think twice about buying EA FC if it had the AO rating.
And not only AO, if it included the same required gambling-warnings other gambling system have to show every time they so much as mention their name.
Probably because CCP wants other countries’ citizens to be addicted to games but not their own.
How else would they have 9-9-6 model if Chinese youth started going down the path of Japanese hikikomoris?
China has always been against gaming it’s the money they like.
I think the CCP are just trying to do what they think is best for the welfare of their people.
If it was only money they wanted they would not do this. The limitations they are imposing will cut revenue to their biggest Game companies. I mean, the laws are not in effect and there was already a big crash on Netease and Tencent stock prices.
China doing a better job regulating corporations than the west is nothing new.
Even this current one happened while Tencent was barely recovering from another regulation set last year. Kicking megacorps while they’re down lol as they should.
Well China doesn’t like companies having power so this is a way to neuter them, especially in response to trying to limit online game consumption already.
Edit: Tencent is apparently the most profitable company in china right now so this is a direct attack at their profits most likely, not just China doing good
Edit2: This video goes into it a bit https://youtu.be/uieLEIVlQgc?si=mNiOlXPn9k7V6XX-
God, I hope they do that here. Would clear the appstores and other stores of 90% of shovelware overnight.
I would’ve expected to see something like thus out of the EU rather than China, but at least somebody’s making the first move against the predatory monetisation of apps
Hi Tim
If only those “think of the children” politicians would do this instead of attempting to ban encryption.
You know you look really bad when the CCP shows you up!
There’s no money in it
The Chinese government has started it‘s witch hunt against video games years ago and we have yet to see any of their draconic laws being enforced. It looks like they made them just so they can cherry pick and suppress whoever disagrees with them one way or another. This will be no exception. Gambling, prostitution and porn are all illegal in mainland China but it has always been a huge and open business in every part of the country.
If China’s plan is successful, other countries will follow suit.
PS: RIP my free intertwined fates in Gaming (Jiaming) Impact.
What’s predatory about this? This seems like the least forced purchase in the world – absolutely nobody needs the things they’re selling. They are like a definition of a luxury item.
Predatory as in they literally employ psychologists to help design them to be as addictive as they can be, then they market it towards kids or at the very least don’t really do anything to prevent kids from gambling in them (yeah it’s also partially a parenting issue but can’t really expect all parents to be tech savvy enough to understand all everything about gaming).
Then there’s the other sucky, but just not sucky enough for it to be an illegal side of things: games that these mechanics suck ass and we are getting less and less objectively good games because more and more games seek to make some quick buck by making their games casinos of sorts.
It’s only as luxurious as being addicted to cocaine in hopes that the next line will hit like the first one, or in game terms, hoping that the next loot box gets you the skin/character/whatever you wanted and releases that quick dopamine rush. Rinse and repeat.
I think the comparison to cocaine is apt. Therefore I find it increasingly odd how parents purchase their children cocaine-delivery mechanisms, and how society deems all this completely legal.
This will also make for better and more enjoyable games. I wonder if players will want to spend more times with those games then.
Do you all expect localization is tied to laws for china? I realy don’t think so. Most games are split into global and asia/chinese versions anyway. Why should they remove these mechanics when it isn’t necessary for the market they operate in?
The thought process is that for many games, the majority of their revenue comes from these mechanics and from China. The games themselves will need to change to get revenue flowing. And new games won’t be made with this revenue source in general.
This is similar to how eu regulations can lead to global changes sometimes, China is a big enough market to affect things globally.
Yep, I’m not in the EU but thanks to the GDPR I still see the cookies thing on almost every website I go, sometimes these things have a good ripple effect.
Good. These kinds of transactions are exploitative and prey in the weaknesses of people with addictive personalities
If there’s a behavior psychologist/researcher involved in the creation of a product, it’s evil, simple as. Those gacha games absolutely use them.
I think you could go two ways with that. The psychologist could be under a mandate to give feedback to ensure your game is not going to be an addiction or they could be under a mandate to make it as addictive as possible. The latter is way more likely but I wouldn’t totally rule out the value add of any psychologist to any game.
deleted by creator
Just to add to your profound insight, water is probably wet.
China being based as always
“As always” is pretty strong, even in this context.
It’s a bit of a hyperbole of course. But China is generally much better at regulating corporations like this.
That’s what absolute power gets you. Zero checks and balance from the legislative, executive, and judicial system.
removed by mod
You are allowed to completely disagree with leadership and goverment policies and actions and still agree with reasonable restrictions and laws. Course I haven’t looked into this so it could very well go way too far.
Nope fuck china and their government. Even a broken clock is right twice a day, doesn’t mean you should expect it and support it.
Fuck china and fuck everyone that supports the CCP.
Damn this ‘broken clock’ is strangely good at being right. With their CO2 emmissions plateuing last month and even starting to fall while targeting zero emissions by 2060, them spearheading cleaner energy this month with the first 4th gen nuclear reactor, and boosting trans rights with a court ruling just last week.
And of course the current new regulation in this post happening right now.
Ffs only on lemmy can you get shit on for telling ccp supporters to fuck off, china and russia are just barely worse than the states(also fuck america) for most corrupt shithole countries.
Fuck china and and fuck you, you tankie piece of garbage. Go back to weibo or hexbear where you belong you piece of shit.
removed by mod
I don’t care for ol Winnie and his Thousand Acre Ego, and hate many things China has done. In far too many ways they are backwards, explicitly destructive, and often refuse to negotiate.
However, and likely due to the overreach of government there, they certainly can and do make decisions I can at least agree with. If it wasn’t for the general conniving and “fuck you, I prefer one-way streets” way of essentially absolute control, I’d argue they were the good guys. Problem is we know better. The world isn’t that simple.
I just wish it was.
We’d be so much further along as a race if we could work together.
Ah, the redditor China BadTM mindset. Love it