If the modding community likes Starfield it should really help with the emptiness of space at least. I can imagine the idea of just building an entire quest line in your selected planet would be nice for avoiding mod conflicts
I’ve heard secondhand the people working on a coop mod, after making one for Skyrim, gave up on it after deciding the game is just bad and uninteresting.
I know that happened but I’d need to see more of a consensus from modders before I call it a wash. If modders continue to add to the game, it will likely become more appealing and the actual foundation to add mods seems pretty decent.
Peter Molyneux is not involved with the project or studio so there’s actually a chance we might have both reasonable expectations and promises delivered. I had to google around to make sure; initially I was going to link some stuff about how trusting Molyneux is really dumb.
It’s nice Bethesda wants to pull a Cyberpunk, but Starfield at it’s core just isn’t as good. I’m all for some redeeming updates though, because at least there would be something to come back to
I already liked the game since I’m not the typical bethesda fan, “their” only game I finished was New Vegas, liked the characters and story and didn’t care that planets were empty since I played Daggerfal Unity.
But I don’t think they can grab that explorer fanbase again, they are just against procedural generation in general, they probably wanted Outer Worlds but bigger.
But I don’t think they can grab that explorer fanbase again, they are just against procedural generation in general, they probably wanted Outer Worlds but bigger.
I don’t think that’s true. Elite Dangerous is one of my favorite games and it’s procedurally generated. I think the issue is that that’s not exactly what Starfield is.
When you “land” in Starfield (outside a handcrafted city or similar), you land in a procedurally generated box made just for you. It isn’t repeatable by anybody but you. Other people who “land” in the same spot will not see what you saw, they get their own procedurally generated box. The contents of the box are similar (the terrain is the right color, the flora and fauna are the same). If you were to see something particularly cool in your box (although I never did when I was playing the game) - ie: “unusually tall mountain range” or “unusually deep valley” - you can’t tell someone “hey go to coordinates x,y and check this out!” You CAN do this in Elite Dangerous. All worlds, all settlements - everything is the same for everyone, and if you explore through it all and you find something interesting, you can share it with people.
In Starfield, your box always contains an uninteresting/unremarkable patch of terrain and magically, literally everywhere you land, there are structures and ships within walking distance - none of which anyone can get to but you.
There is literally no WAY to explore. Everywhere you land, it’s just another box and it will always contain the same variation on the same things. That isn’t exploration. Exploration implies things that exist whether you are there or not and which can be found by someone if they look long enough.
I think you’ve excellently captured the difference here. I didn’t get heavily into Elite Dangerous, but on one of my longest journeys, I scanned a few things that no-one had ever scanned before. I didn’t discover any awesome looking space phenomena that would be worth sharing (at least, none that hadn’t been discovered before), but the prospect that I could was exciting.
Even just the idea that my name would be on other people’s screens if they came and scanned the same things I did, because we were all sharing the same world.
This is the most precise presentation about what I hated about Starfield. I gave up about 5ish hours in when the 3rd planet I landed on to explore was literally the same as the first two. Maybe it was just me, maybe it was unlucky lottery, but the fast travel to multiple boxes with the same ingredients shaken up slightly was enough to make me walk away.
If people liked it, I’m very happy for them, it just didn’t do it for me and I feel like it’s starting to be diminishing returns with Bethesda after Fallout 3/Skyrim (though I’m sure someone will correct me with an older drop off point).
If I remember it correctly, everything in E:D is procedurally generated, but every player has the same seed so it generates everything identically. That’s how they keep the installation a manageable size.
Yes and this is what Starfield doesn’t do. Starfield doesn’t actually have whole planets generated by a shared seed. Planets in Starfield are just unlimited sources of randomly generated playboxes. Since the planets don’t actually exist, they can’t properly be said to be explorable.
For anyone interested in this topic, there is a super great video that explains the difference between procedural generation and random generation and how a tiny amount of data can be used to generate extremely complex things.
Part of the reason why Bethesda games visually looks bad is because their tied to the hip with creation engine for modders to use. Part of the reason why bethesda games have soo many mods is because of how much of the games engine is open to modders to modify.
The thing is, cyberpunk also has mod support, and it’s pretty good, I use a climbing mod, a drone mancer class mod, and before the 2.1 update it already had a metro system via mod.
I’d say “i will pick it up on a sale in a year or two” but they’re just going to release the enhanced / special / anniversary / superspace edition down the line too, so why bother
God, what a dick sucking award. Cyberpunk may be playable now, but it did fuck all to deserve that.
Better games launched excellent and got better with age. Launching to get removed from online stores and taking years to reach playable is not the best ongoing anything.
It truly was a Great Gamer Gaslighting after that anime was released. Suddenly, cyberpunk was a work of art and everyone wanted to revisit it to see places from the anime. They hadn’t even done much to fix it yet at that point, and may even have still been dealing with legal stuff from all the stuff they promised that wasn’t in the game.
The PR turn around with that game was wild to watch, it happened almost overnight. And Gamerz TM did it to themselves.
Thank corporate morons forcing devs to the door to meet ridiculous timelines, they don’t give a fuck if it’s ready or not.
I’m a SWE and my manager would tell me shit like “even Apple pushed out the iPhone with some bugs”, “at some point you have to wrap it and ship it”, etc. Mgmt uses this bullshit to feel better about their (or their bosses) poorly balanced priorities and decisions.
It’s all about announce early, bag as much interest and money as possible and then ship it regardless if it’s reached the definition of done or not (you better believe mgmt will throw those goalposts around as they see fit)
Pre-ordering morons hold some blame here as well as they play right into the bullshit I’m talking about
Nakey Jakey recently did a super indepth video on what is wrong with Starfield. And suffice it to say, I’ve removed the game from my wishlist. There’s betterr games to spend my money on.
Man, if they release a “pokemon emerald” version of starfield and slap a goty title on it, that just confirms the company only breathes in order to try and blow smoke up our asses
Honestly I let my Gamepass lapse and was considering re-upping it to play Starfield. And now I am for sure not going to re-up it for Starfield. Maybe I’ll visit it in a few years, but it sounds like not a great time from Nakey Jakey’s review on it.
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If the modding community likes Starfield it should really help with the emptiness of space at least. I can imagine the idea of just building an entire quest line in your selected planet would be nice for avoiding mod conflicts
I’ve heard secondhand the people working on a coop mod, after making one for Skyrim, gave up on it after deciding the game is just bad and uninteresting.
I know that happened but I’d need to see more of a consensus from modders before I call it a wash. If modders continue to add to the game, it will likely become more appealing and the actual foundation to add mods seems pretty decent.
I haven’t bought Starfield, was waiting for sub-$25. If there are no mods, I’m lowering that to sub-$10.
Seriously what a clusterfuck of a game this has been. I’m so happy I didn’t bite and buy it yet.
oh boy, now i get to enjoy… basic features that should have been there at launch?
seems this is a recurring thing nowadays. i pray to god fable 4 doesn’t suck the big one.
Putting your faith in a fable game to live up to expectations is a terrible move.
Peter Molyneux is not involved with the project or studio so there’s actually a chance we might have both reasonable expectations and promises delivered. I had to google around to make sure; initially I was going to link some stuff about how trusting Molyneux is really dumb.
Instead it’s a title made by a studio that’s about 3 levels removed from the original creators.
It’s nice Bethesda wants to pull a Cyberpunk, but Starfield at it’s core just isn’t as good. I’m all for some redeeming updates though, because at least there would be something to come back to
I already liked the game since I’m not the typical bethesda fan, “their” only game I finished was New Vegas, liked the characters and story and didn’t care that planets were empty since I played Daggerfal Unity. But I don’t think they can grab that explorer fanbase again, they are just against procedural generation in general, they probably wanted Outer Worlds but bigger.
I don’t think that’s true. Elite Dangerous is one of my favorite games and it’s procedurally generated. I think the issue is that that’s not exactly what Starfield is.
When you “land” in Starfield (outside a handcrafted city or similar), you land in a procedurally generated box made just for you. It isn’t repeatable by anybody but you. Other people who “land” in the same spot will not see what you saw, they get their own procedurally generated box. The contents of the box are similar (the terrain is the right color, the flora and fauna are the same). If you were to see something particularly cool in your box (although I never did when I was playing the game) - ie: “unusually tall mountain range” or “unusually deep valley” - you can’t tell someone “hey go to coordinates x,y and check this out!” You CAN do this in Elite Dangerous. All worlds, all settlements - everything is the same for everyone, and if you explore through it all and you find something interesting, you can share it with people.
In Starfield, your box always contains an uninteresting/unremarkable patch of terrain and magically, literally everywhere you land, there are structures and ships within walking distance - none of which anyone can get to but you.
There is literally no WAY to explore. Everywhere you land, it’s just another box and it will always contain the same variation on the same things. That isn’t exploration. Exploration implies things that exist whether you are there or not and which can be found by someone if they look long enough.
I think you’ve excellently captured the difference here. I didn’t get heavily into Elite Dangerous, but on one of my longest journeys, I scanned a few things that no-one had ever scanned before. I didn’t discover any awesome looking space phenomena that would be worth sharing (at least, none that hadn’t been discovered before), but the prospect that I could was exciting.
Even just the idea that my name would be on other people’s screens if they came and scanned the same things I did, because we were all sharing the same world.
This is the most precise presentation about what I hated about Starfield. I gave up about 5ish hours in when the 3rd planet I landed on to explore was literally the same as the first two. Maybe it was just me, maybe it was unlucky lottery, but the fast travel to multiple boxes with the same ingredients shaken up slightly was enough to make me walk away.
If people liked it, I’m very happy for them, it just didn’t do it for me and I feel like it’s starting to be diminishing returns with Bethesda after Fallout 3/Skyrim (though I’m sure someone will correct me with an older drop off point).
If I remember it correctly, everything in E:D is procedurally generated, but every player has the same seed so it generates everything identically. That’s how they keep the installation a manageable size.
Yes and this is what Starfield doesn’t do. Starfield doesn’t actually have whole planets generated by a shared seed. Planets in Starfield are just unlimited sources of randomly generated playboxes. Since the planets don’t actually exist, they can’t properly be said to be explorable.
For anyone interested in this topic, there is a super great video that explains the difference between procedural generation and random generation and how a tiny amount of data can be used to generate extremely complex things.
“all new ways of traveling”
Will they add a metro?
The main feature I want is better optimization. It’s really not good still and I’ve played with the settings more than I wanted to
Last months patch did a lot for optimization, especially on the cpu and non amd gpu builds, seeing double digit gains.
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Part of the reason why Bethesda games visually looks bad is because their tied to the hip with creation engine for modders to use. Part of the reason why bethesda games have soo many mods is because of how much of the games engine is open to modders to modify.
The thing is, cyberpunk also has mod support, and it’s pretty good, I use a climbing mod, a drone mancer class mod, and before the 2.1 update it already had a metro system via mod.
It pales in conparison to what modders do with bethesda games.
Modders can legitamately put other games into a bethesdasoft title (tale of two wastelands, skyblivion, morrowblivion, skywind)
Take for example, the games let you outright add your own physics engine.
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Glad to see they’re still improving it. When I get the Ultra Game of the Year Turbo Deluxe edition for $20 in years to come, I no doubt will enjoy it.
At the same time, I’ll be spending my $20 to buy Skyrim again so I can run it on my toaster.
I’m gonna wait for the Ultra Game of the Year Turbo Deluxe edition Complete
For TheComputerV2
Can’t forget the Ultra Game of the Year Turbo Deluxe Complete Anniversary edition, now with built-in mods.
i didnt play new vegas until the ultimate edition was 5 bucks at wal mart. thankfully avoiding the horrid bugs it had on launch
I’d say “i will pick it up on a sale in a year or two” but they’re just going to release the enhanced / special / anniversary / superspace edition down the line too, so why bother
it’s like AAA games are only early access these days
In two years they can get the award for “best ongoing game” then, just like Cyberpunk :D
God, what a dick sucking award. Cyberpunk may be playable now, but it did fuck all to deserve that.
Better games launched excellent and got better with age. Launching to get removed from online stores and taking years to reach playable is not the best ongoing anything.
It truly was a Great Gamer Gaslighting after that anime was released. Suddenly, cyberpunk was a work of art and everyone wanted to revisit it to see places from the anime. They hadn’t even done much to fix it yet at that point, and may even have still been dealing with legal stuff from all the stuff they promised that wasn’t in the game.
The PR turn around with that game was wild to watch, it happened almost overnight. And Gamerz TM did it to themselves.
To be fair, it was a bomb-ass anime
/s
Haha I have heard that. It’s on my to-watch list for sure
The worst part is that I’ve played early access games that have more shit going for them than Starfield
Thank corporate morons forcing devs to the door to meet ridiculous timelines, they don’t give a fuck if it’s ready or not.
I’m a SWE and my manager would tell me shit like “even Apple pushed out the iPhone with some bugs”, “at some point you have to wrap it and ship it”, etc. Mgmt uses this bullshit to feel better about their (or their bosses) poorly balanced priorities and decisions.
It’s all about announce early, bag as much interest and money as possible and then ship it regardless if it’s reached the definition of done or not (you better believe mgmt will throw those goalposts around as they see fit)
Pre-ordering morons hold some blame here as well as they play right into the bullshit I’m talking about
why the surprise? as long as people keep buying they will try to squize more money for less effort.
Nakey Jakey recently did a super indepth video on what is wrong with Starfield. And suffice it to say, I’ve removed the game from my wishlist. There’s betterr games to spend my money on.
If you too have an unhealthy relationship with absurdly long video essays, I’d point you in the direction of PatricianTV’s Starfield analysis.
I for one absolutely do, thanks for the rec
You’re very welcome. If you get the chance, let me know what you thought of it.
I desperately want to watch his 8 hour analysis of Starfield but am scared of the commitment.
Advice for consumption Patrician himself posted on his 24-hr Skyrim analysis:
Commenting a timestamp is a nice way to get “engagement” for the algorithm.
Absolutely but it is also far more reliable than however YouTube tracks your progress. A win-win.
I agree.
It’s almost always better to wait on Bethesda titles and buy the goty/complete edition a few years later.
Man, if they release a “pokemon emerald” version of starfield and slap a goty title on it, that just confirms the company only breathes in order to try and blow smoke up our asses
Maybe it’s time to just stop giving Bethesda money all together. Or until they start releasing games when they’re finished.
Guess that could be said about any AAA company though
Yeah yeah, wake me up when AI modders recreate Daggerfall in the ES6 engine.
Are they doing a new engine for ES6?
Yes, Creation Engine 3
/s
I think people would hate it again, seeing how they hated Starfield that is also procedural.
You’d have to change Daggerfall so that you can’t run, only fast travel, between dungeons and cities to truly mirror the Starfield experience.
Still not buying that garbage.
Honestly I let my Gamepass lapse and was considering re-upping it to play Starfield. And now I am for sure not going to re-up it for Starfield. Maybe I’ll visit it in a few years, but it sounds like not a great time from Nakey Jakey’s review on it.
He provided so many examples of how it’s worse than Skyrim 😅
Just the fact that the ship combat is awful AND you don’t get to fly your ship TO other planets makes this a pass for me.