Does this game need client-side anticheat at all? It’s not PvP, so if you’re cheating, you just ruin the experience for yourself and maybe your teammates. But as far as I know, there are no rankings and not really any competition.
Not ruining the fun is kind of the point, and not all hackers and cheaters are benevolent, greifing other players in their game.
Further more, every victory adds to the score for that planet and factoring into the galactic score, which is the primary vehicle for storytelling to the community. Which the Devs clearly want to be a community effort of the players and also feedsback into how they balance the game.
So cheaters or hackers adding a lot of false data or win to that pool could result in the devs overturning new content, nerfing existing items or buffing enemies to put the difficulty curve where they want it. I don’t think many players would appreciate a sudden difficulty spike because cheaters made the game too easy.
The fuck it is. There’s no economy, simultaneous instancing, raids, rarity of weapons/armor/items/mounts, and the “DM” makes completely arbitrary game-wide decisions. Hell, there’s barely even a “levelling” system. You high? 🤪
edit: not only is the "anti-cheat stupid simple to bypass, should you want to, therealconcern should be that it’s a kernel-level invasion of privacy for no fucking reason… but who cares, right? 😅😶
I agree with the statement about anti cheat software being cancer, but a multi-player game ridden with cheaters is usually a very bad experience as well.
I don’t have a dog in this fight, but I don’t like it when people accuse someone of an altered state of consciousness just for disagreeing with them. Statistically it gets used more often on neurodivergent people, because neurodivergence is an altered state if consciousness. Neurotypicals will see that autistic people think differently, and then accuse them of drug use not realising it’s actually autism. While this is done with innocent intentions, the statistical sum total result is that autistic people get accused of being high more often than neurotypicals. It terminates the discussion, and if autistic people get treated like that at all times, then they’re treated as not of sound mind at all times. I don’t have a problem with drugs at all, but the thing is a stoner has the option of sobering up and being treated like an adult again. While an ND person just gets infantilised at all times for existing, because their genuine experiences are dismissed by NTs as drug addled nonsense. So I think we as a society should just stop accusing strangers on the internet who disagree with us of being high. It’s not clever and it’s not funny, anyway.
I actually joined a match with cheaters. They are dropping stratigems non-stop. Firing unlimited eats. It wasn’t fun at all. And when I extracted on the mission they maxed out all of the sample types. It really ruined the gameplay loop. It was not a great time
From my understanding, devs could detect such cheats like cooldownless stratagems or obtaining phantom samples server-side without the need of anti-cheat. It’s the FPS mechanics cheats that are hard to catch.
Probably they are relying on their anticheat too much.
No need for pinpoint accuracy when you are doing half a ton of explosives via close air support or heavy artillery from low orbit. Or worst: a mortar turret with no regard for friendlies.
Is it though? It had less explosive growth than Helldivers 2, but it sold 8+ million copies, not counting everyone playing it on game pass for free.
Also this is hardly scientific, but just looking at my friends list (of 60 people), over 50% of my friends own deep rock, nearly making it the single most commonly owned game among my friends. The only games I see that are more popular are left4dead 2 and the portal games. In comparison, just over 25% of my friends have Helldivers 2. Obviously a sample size of 60 isn’t enough to extrapolate to overall popularity, but from what I’ve seen Deep Rock has been extremely consistently popular for years.
It’s done well enough to turn its studio into an independent publisher, and just having a spin-off game sharing the Deep Rock name was enough to sell a million copies in a month of early access.
Whether or not the game needs this anti-cheat feature, players are still finding ways to give other players huge amounts of Samples (a grindable resource with limited amounts included in each mission) and spawn in unreleased equipment and stratagems.
So clearly the GameGuard isn’t as useful as it could be.
the game updates based on the actions of other players, with planets being liberated and events having them taken back by the enemies. if the game had a big hacker problem it would negatively effect the game. plus having a hacker make your mission a free win would not be fun
I played it, waiting for it to get good. It just never did for me. Maybe I’m missing something, but after 10 hours I felt like I’d seen pretty much everything.
As for the anti-cheat, I understand why they’d have that. I’ve played so many games where people cheat and it just kills the fun. Even when it is PvE.
I don’t really understand the mindset of the cheaters though. Do they think we all talk about how great they are after the game is over? Like, Bobfucker326 sure did shoot more stuff than any random player I’ve ever seen, he must have a massive wang and be great at maths and stuff.
The game has a ton of subtle mechanics that it doesn’t really go out of its way to tell you about. So there’s a degree of mastery and cross-polination of strategy and builds that take advantage of those mechanics between groups, which adds a lot of fun for me. I respect how that’s not for everyone though.
Honestly the game doesn’t have that much content but I do love the gameplay loop. The emergent gameplay is fantastic in my opinion. The worst part is all the fucking technical issues
To be fair to them they’re deliberately holding back content to organically drip feed it in. I’m pretty confident we’ll see a new faction in the next week or two. And probably more vehicles in the next 4 weeks.
It’s a bit rough around the edges and the patches introducing new issues like the arc weapon crash had been deeply upsetting. Hopefully we’re past the worst of it.
I will cheat in single player games. I give it a solid “first time” unmodded play through. If it’s good, I’ll do other “paths” or “builds” depending on the game.
Then make it a little more… interesting, or different even.
Then you work up to Total Conversions, and thats fucking great for longevity.
Then at a certain point, its quality of life. I don’t want to spend 20 hours getting to the “interesting” part of the game. I can no longer get even just an hour to dive into a game uninterrupted. I love immersion; in the past it was an unhealthy escape mechanism, now when I get it, its a breath of not dealing with my day to day shit for just a little bit. Life always gets in the way of living, at least the way we want or need to in the moment. But I digress…
But cheating in a multiplayer game really defeats the purpose of multiplayer. An unbalanced play field isn’t fun for anyone.
I’d like to see more games embrace a modding community. If you and a few friends want to play with mods A, B, D, and F, more power to you guys. Keep enjoying that game.
I like to play game normally, but i get bored easily… So i find it challenging to find a cheat or any bug and be ultra strong character or anything i want to be. I play games so i can relieve from my stress not to be stressful or frustrated to beat a boss.
Yeah I agree cheat in PvP is Unfair.
But cheat with PvE where I’m not harming anyone for their rank at leader board. That’s fine by me.
And if not, being engaged with the community on discord or Reddit. Knowing which fronts the community is working on and joining in really helps the kind of meta/RP aspects of the game.
I really wanted to like helldivers and it was fun for a few days but I’ve just lost all interest just about, which is a shame because there is potential there
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Well yeah, I would hope it limits the ability of some of them. Like the ones that are cheating, duh
Does this game need client-side anticheat at all? It’s not PvP, so if you’re cheating, you just ruin the experience for yourself and maybe your teammates. But as far as I know, there are no rankings and not really any competition.
Not ruining the fun is kind of the point, and not all hackers and cheaters are benevolent, greifing other players in their game.
Further more, every victory adds to the score for that planet and factoring into the galactic score, which is the primary vehicle for storytelling to the community. Which the Devs clearly want to be a community effort of the players and also feedsback into how they balance the game.
So cheaters or hackers adding a lot of false data or win to that pool could result in the devs overturning new content, nerfing existing items or buffing enemies to put the difficulty curve where they want it. I don’t think many players would appreciate a sudden difficulty spike because cheaters made the game too easy.
No, the game is basically a MMORPG, so even though the players aren’t against each other, cheaters would ruin the fun for everyone.
The fuck it is. There’s no economy, simultaneous instancing, raids, rarity of weapons/armor/items/mounts, and the “DM” makes completely arbitrary game-wide decisions. Hell, there’s barely even a “levelling” system. You high? 🤪
edit: not only is the "anti-cheat stupid simple to bypass, should you want to, the real concern should be that it’s a kernel-level invasion of privacy for no fucking reason… but who cares, right? 😅😶
I agree with the statement about anti cheat software being cancer, but a multi-player game ridden with cheaters is usually a very bad experience as well.
About the other stuff… Not really.
So, you’re high. Cool, no judgement, but a disclaimer’s only polite.
I don’t have a dog in this fight, but I don’t like it when people accuse someone of an altered state of consciousness just for disagreeing with them. Statistically it gets used more often on neurodivergent people, because neurodivergence is an altered state if consciousness. Neurotypicals will see that autistic people think differently, and then accuse them of drug use not realising it’s actually autism. While this is done with innocent intentions, the statistical sum total result is that autistic people get accused of being high more often than neurotypicals. It terminates the discussion, and if autistic people get treated like that at all times, then they’re treated as not of sound mind at all times. I don’t have a problem with drugs at all, but the thing is a stoner has the option of sobering up and being treated like an adult again. While an ND person just gets infantilised at all times for existing, because their genuine experiences are dismissed by NTs as drug addled nonsense. So I think we as a society should just stop accusing strangers on the internet who disagree with us of being high. It’s not clever and it’s not funny, anyway.
I actually joined a match with cheaters. They are dropping stratigems non-stop. Firing unlimited eats. It wasn’t fun at all. And when I extracted on the mission they maxed out all of the sample types. It really ruined the gameplay loop. It was not a great time
From my understanding, devs could detect such cheats like cooldownless stratagems or obtaining phantom samples server-side without the need of anti-cheat. It’s the FPS mechanics cheats that are hard to catch.
Probably they are relying on their anticheat too much.
What stopped you from just leaving and finding a new game?
I did.
This shows that not only is the anti cheat dangerous because of its kernel access, it’s also useless since cheaters are bypassing anyways…
Since it has friendly fire, I imagine an aimbot would be one of the worst things for the game.
If you want to shoot your teammates, you can do that just fine without an aimbot
No need for pinpoint accuracy when you are doing half a ton of explosives via close air support or heavy artillery from low orbit. Or worst: a mortar turret with no regard for friendlies.
I haven’t played it, but it seems very similar to Deep Rock Galactic which does perfectly fine without anticheat.
Deep rock’s much less widely popular though, so it enjoys the benefits of a small, chill community
Is it though? It had less explosive growth than Helldivers 2, but it sold 8+ million copies, not counting everyone playing it on game pass for free.
Also this is hardly scientific, but just looking at my friends list (of 60 people), over 50% of my friends own deep rock, nearly making it the single most commonly owned game among my friends. The only games I see that are more popular are left4dead 2 and the portal games. In comparison, just over 25% of my friends have Helldivers 2. Obviously a sample size of 60 isn’t enough to extrapolate to overall popularity, but from what I’ve seen Deep Rock has been extremely consistently popular for years.
It’s done well enough to turn its studio into an independent publisher, and just having a spin-off game sharing the Deep Rock name was enough to sell a million copies in a month of early access.
It’s probably mostly there to try to protect the microtransactions for some of the cosmetics.
Whether or not the game needs this anti-cheat feature, players are still finding ways to give other players huge amounts of Samples (a grindable resource with limited amounts included in each mission) and spawn in unreleased equipment and stratagems.
So clearly the GameGuard isn’t as useful as it could be.
My main concern would be hackers, not cheaters
Right? Ring 0 kernel level access is pretty stupid to give a random company. I was gifted this game on steam and immediately returned it.
the game updates based on the actions of other players, with planets being liberated and events having them taken back by the enemies. if the game had a big hacker problem it would negatively effect the game. plus having a hacker make your mission a free win would not be fun
Really wanted to like this game. The hype had me.
I played it, waiting for it to get good. It just never did for me. Maybe I’m missing something, but after 10 hours I felt like I’d seen pretty much everything.
As for the anti-cheat, I understand why they’d have that. I’ve played so many games where people cheat and it just kills the fun. Even when it is PvE.
I don’t really understand the mindset of the cheaters though. Do they think we all talk about how great they are after the game is over? Like, Bobfucker326 sure did shoot more stuff than any random player I’ve ever seen, he must have a massive wang and be great at maths and stuff.
The game has a ton of subtle mechanics that it doesn’t really go out of its way to tell you about. So there’s a degree of mastery and cross-polination of strategy and builds that take advantage of those mechanics between groups, which adds a lot of fun for me. I respect how that’s not for everyone though.
Honestly the game doesn’t have that much content but I do love the gameplay loop. The emergent gameplay is fantastic in my opinion. The worst part is all the fucking technical issues
To be fair to them they’re deliberately holding back content to organically drip feed it in. I’m pretty confident we’ll see a new faction in the next week or two. And probably more vehicles in the next 4 weeks.
It’s a bit rough around the edges and the patches introducing new issues like the arc weapon crash had been deeply upsetting. Hopefully we’re past the worst of it.
I will cheat in single player games. I give it a solid “first time” unmodded play through. If it’s good, I’ll do other “paths” or “builds” depending on the game.
Then make it a little more… interesting, or different even.
Then you work up to Total Conversions, and thats fucking great for longevity.
Then at a certain point, its quality of life. I don’t want to spend 20 hours getting to the “interesting” part of the game. I can no longer get even just an hour to dive into a game uninterrupted. I love immersion; in the past it was an unhealthy escape mechanism, now when I get it, its a breath of not dealing with my day to day shit for just a little bit. Life always gets in the way of living, at least the way we want or need to in the moment. But I digress…
But cheating in a multiplayer game really defeats the purpose of multiplayer. An unbalanced play field isn’t fun for anyone.
I’d like to see more games embrace a modding community. If you and a few friends want to play with mods A, B, D, and F, more power to you guys. Keep enjoying that game.
Just don’t force an imbalance on other people.
I like to play game normally, but i get bored easily… So i find it challenging to find a cheat or any bug and be ultra strong character or anything i want to be. I play games so i can relieve from my stress not to be stressful or frustrated to beat a boss.
Yeah I agree cheat in PvP is Unfair.
But cheat with PvE where I’m not harming anyone for their rank at leader board. That’s fine by me.
I think the key you’re missing is a friend group. The game excels when you play with friends you already know
Accidental friendly fire and crazy shouting when getting ambushed is like 60% of the fun of Helldivers 2.
For me, playing with friends is the vast majority of my playtime anyway since the little time that I get, I want to spend with my friends.
And if not, being engaged with the community on discord or Reddit. Knowing which fronts the community is working on and joining in really helps the kind of meta/RP aspects of the game.
Yeah, it’s a good “playing with the gang” game. Friday night crack a brew or a blunt and just mindlessly shoot and laugh at dumb stuff.
Absolutly. Sometimes you find randoms that speak, or manage to work together and it is also good. But friends is the top tier.
I’m amazed it even works on linux, guess there is one benefit of using some shady unknown Korean kernel level anticheat instead of EAC.
EAC does work on Linux, developers just have to flip a toggle switch to support Linux. Some devs just don’t want to do that.
Halo MCC, Apex Legends, Back 4 blood, and Smite are all games that use EAC and work on Linux.
And basically no kernel anticheat will work on Linux. So Helldivers 2 isn’t kernel anticheat, just user-space.
Helldivers 2’s anti-cheat (nProtect GameGuard) is kernel-level on Windows, but has a userspace fallback for linux
Edit: see this post
Good to know.
I did forget apex legends works, boggles the mind that EA’s most popular multiplayer game just werks on linux. But most EAC using games don’t sadly.
And the anti cheat functions in user space! No special permissions required.
Literally the only reason I decided to buy it.
So glad I didn’t waste my money on this. But why called it “Helldiver’s anti-cheat” there’s no way they’re using their own.
It’s N-protect game guard. But if you say that in a headline, normies don’t know wtf you’re talking about.
What N are they protecting from?
I really wanted to like helldivers and it was fun for a few days but I’ve just lost all interest just about, which is a shame because there is potential there
They should at least give the option for friend groups to play without anticheat.