Fair pricing means a reasonable profit on the base cost. Trying to gauge what people are willing to pay means that you want to maximise your profit at all costs, consumers be damned.
I understand that’s what Americans consider “fair”, but I don’t fully agree.
The top end Steam Deck was like $750 at release. Replace the screen with better CPU and GPU, and there’s your baseline for the Machine. Since it’s “6x” performance, price will probably be a bit higher. People thinking way less are smoking crack.
How many of you have actually had a Linux PC connected to your living room TV? I built one about 13 years ago (and upgraded the guts occasionally) and it’s been awesome. With a regular web browser you can watch YouTube (with uBlock of course), Plex/Jellyfin, or any streaming service, in addition to gaming. Plus I’ve done stuff like vacation planning with my partner, where we can easily bring up maps and hotel listings from our couch without hunching over a laptop or tablet.
While Linux hardware support is quite good these days, there’s still something to be said for buying a machine that you know is fully supported and targeted by game devs.
I’m happily running an Intel NUC as TV computer since 2013, and it’s awesome for exactly the reasons you state. I invested in it when I realized how fully crap the “smart” features of my Samsung TV are. The ultimate controller for it is a combo keyboard and touchpad, I have the Logitech K400r.
The NUC is starting to show it’s age now with its 4th gen i5, and I’m in the process of replacing it with a mini PC with an Intel N100.
Just set this up after the whole windows 10 support drop thing, and holy shit!!! This is awesome! Not only no ads but I can Strawhat everything! Just got a figure out how to do this for my phone now
Had a Windows PC hooked up to my TV in I think 2008, before streaming boxes and mass adoption of Netflix. Then it was dualboot for a while starting in I think 2015, originally with Ubuntu. Now it’s full time CachyOS Linux as of 2023.
It’s always been great. Wireless keyboard with the built in trackpad, plus originally 360 controllers but now 8BitDo Ultimate controllers. Plus I use it for homelab tinkering.
I know speculation is fun, but until we know the price officially, all of this is moot. Wait until next year when they announce actual pricing and judge it then for its value.
I, personally, don’t think it’ll be a successful product if it isn’t less than $800. They don’t have to have it cost console prices, but it does need to be at least somewhat within spitting distance. If the price is the cost of an Xbox or Playstation plus, say…a year of their online service subscription, I think that could be marketable.
If it’s closer to a grand, it’ll be a flop like the first Steam Machines.
I went to PCPartPicker and tried to assemble a similarly spec’d PC, not with the absolute cheapest components, but definitely from the lower end sorted by price, it came out close to $800.
I guess if Valve can price it at that and be smaller it might have a market, but if much more than that people are better off just buying a PC.
P.S. Since Valve is not buying retail I think there is room for lower than that, and it’d definitely be welcome, but I’m not sure Valve will make that decision.
PCPartPicker has a general price tracker where you can see how much RAM has spiked in such a short time. It really emphasizes how crazy things have gotten
Brother it’s so bad. I’ve been trying to help a friend do one recently, or at least plan it, and I’ve watched my previously $85 2x16 sticks of GSkill DDR5 (like the cheapest option I had) shoot up to like $260 in under a month has been insane. It’s not even good ram…
I recently (a few months ago) built a new high-end server for my homelab, and bought 512GB of DDR4 ECC RAM for around $510. I just looked it up, and those exact same modules are around $2.5k to $3.5k for the same amount. That’s more than I paid for the entire machine.
In the same boat actually. Helping a friend with a build and RAM is ridiculous right now. crappy slower 2x16 kits costing $350 and far beyond. Their desired upper end CPU is less than most RAM kits. I was trying to find a middle ground for them with 2x24 but I can’t even find those kits anymore. Doesn’t help that these days 32 is recommended for some games, let alone aminimum for productivity software. I got lucky when I built. Prices were bad (~150 for 2x24!!) but shot up not even days after I built last month and my kit hasn’t even been in stock since I got it.
Quick question, can you buy a pc and run the same OS and version of steam that this pc they built uses? Im assuming its the same as steam deck. Just wondering if you could build it exactly the same outside just installing steam.
They haven’t released the current version of SteamOS to be installed on any machine and imaging the actual Deck’s OS won’t work on all hardware. You could do the old steam machine OS; but it is not anywhere the same as what the Deck and this new Steam Machine use other than being based on Linux.
There is Bazzite, though, which is not the same OS, but strives to offer the same experience.
They have released the recovery image for the deck, which can be installed on any computer and if you have AMD built pc, it should work just fine. Ofc ymmv.
I have a cheap $250 AMD APU based mini pc I bought off Amazon running SteamOS. I just used the Steam Deck restore USB image to install it. I imagine you could use the Steam Machine image the same way when its available.
SteamOS is not a general purpose OS. It is optimized to run on the Steam Deck (plus the Frame and Gabecube I guess). Its software components are tested on a limited range of hardware (specifically AMD silicon), and it might not have certain optimizations and compatibility fixes that are required by other consumer hardware. It also probably has some proprietary bits, especially the firmware.
The best option is Bazzite. It’s not based on SteamOS, but it is built with a robust gaming experience in focus. You can even get it to boot directly into Steam Big Picture. Watch this loud Aussie man do it!
The other option is HoloISO, which is an independent reimplementation of SteamOS. Their intention is to get as close to the real SteamOS as possible. Hardware support is limited (especially nvidia).
Popping in to champion bazzite, it’s my daily use os and I’ve never found an os that’s as easy and clean to run. So far the only issue I’ve had is that it doesn’t support some laptop wifi cards out of the box.
You can do this now. But it’ll probably be more effort than using something like Bazzite. The image is available publicly. It just assumes a certain set of hardware (AMD GPU, for example). It might be enough to install the GPU drivers you need. Worst case, you might have to recompile the kernel. But all the user space configuration should be fine.
Think about it this way, people. Yes, it may be more expensive than a PlayStation. However, Steam offers numerous deals several times a year, so it will be worth the investment. In the long run, owning a Steam Machine or PC will pay for itself.
Unfortunately, due to the craze of AI server farms, PC parts are becoming more expensive. For example, the price of RAM has doubled, and analysts say that SSDs will suffer the same fate.
The real question is if Valve plans to swallow the jumps in price. They must have designed the machine before the price hikes, so I wonder if they already had a price in mind and whether they’re gonna stick to it.
However, Steam offers numerous deals several times a year, so it will be worth the investment. In the long run, owning a Steam Machine or PC will pay for itself.
And you also don’t have to pay monthly for multiplayer!
I think this geared toward the crowd that plays games, but doesn’t have the latest and greatest hardware nor likes to tinker. This will be an upgrade for a lot of people and the ability to just set it up and play your already existing backlog with ease is the main selling point over power.
It’s an awesome device which will help drive the Linux gaming ecosystem forward, but it’s not for me personally as it doesn’t hold a candle to my PC.
Maybe we will all benefit if the 14 year old kids gets a steam machine, instead of some cheap pos with loads of errors, slowness etc = extra rage in games.
“on your machine” requires you to have a machine. This isn’t for people with computers already. This is for people who are already looking for a new machine, and this becomes the “ready out of the box” option.
If its a decent price I’ll want it. I love the freedom PC gaming allows but sometimes I do miss the convenience of a console. It would be great for my kid as well. No fidling with the display, having the PC not wake properly from sleep, controllers not connecting, etc. It would just work. Our current setup inevitably something doesnt work right first try.
As it says in the article, it’ll be smaller and quieter, so less offensive for most people’s living rooms than a full-size desktop. It’s not meant to replace your existing PC if you have one, unless it was getting old and you were about to replace it anyway. If you don’t have a PC, or don’t have one in the living room, then it might be a better option than anyone else’s prebuilt.
it could become the new standard for industry benchmarking/testing
Exactly. We are already seeing game companies specifically mention the Steam Deck in patch notes. This will give them a standard item to validate compatibility against. Any game company that wants to make sure their game works well will have a Steam Machine on-hand to QA with.
And I fully agree with you on benchmarking. It will be a very standardized system to point to in game reviews.
The biggest advantages it has over other PCs is CEC and Wake on USB(controller) enabled out of the box. Those are the two features I miss the most on my HTPC.
There are people who exist between “I build, format and otherwise manage my own gaming rig,” and “I don’t need a PC for games.”
My partner is a perfect example. She has my old PC shell, with some $500 of GPU, internal memory, and accessories, hooked up to the TV. She uses it daily, almost exclusively for Steam games and streaming services that she finds more comfortable to navigate with a keyboard and mouse. A smaller, quieter, streamlined, “this more or less will do the things you want to do straight out of the box” product would have saved both her (and I, because that thing has had some troubleshooting) a lot of headache, while looking far more presentable to boot.
Maybe she’s the odd one out and the target audience is more niche than my bias’ recognize, but I guess we’ll see for sure when this thing releases.
At least for me, a Steam Machine would be the ideal use case for my brother, since the literal ONLY game he plays is CS2. He used to play Fortnite, but he hasn’t done that in years… and even then if he wanted we could just swap places between my current real computer and the Steam Machine. It’s also really small so it wouldn’t occupy much space on the other room of the house.
I mean, it’s fine to do so, as long as you have PC hardware that meets your needs. Valve would be fine with it too. As long as it can run Steam, all good. For Valve, I expect that the Steam Machine is to provide an easy-to-set-up option a la consoles that let them move into the living room for people who have an issue with that. If you can already use/configure a PC and have one, then that option is gonna work too.
That’s a lot for someone who doesn’t understand computers beyond Windows and MacOS. People also don’t realise that since the PS4 and the Xbox One every console is just a X86-64 machine. So, I think it’s a good move from Valve. Also it will be easier to manage and optimise for Valve if all their hardware is the same, a bit like Apple.
That sucks. I hoped Valve would price it competitively to boost the sales and adoption. But why would I buy this “crippled” PC for the same price I can buy retail? The main gripe for me is Gabecube has no room for upgrade, not even second drive, nothing. Which obviously is not the case with self built PC.
Don’t get me wrong I still like the idea, but the price just must make sense.
I mean crippled like it is “as is”, no space to expand, tinker, swap parts. I’ve also seen a rumor it’ll have locked BIOS, but I hope that’s just a rumor.
IIRC from an earlier article, they’re still looking at factors and don’t yet know for sure (I suspect that it might be that Trump tariffs and whether they will stand is an input).
I’m curious to see how the price will be affected as consumer PCs get stronger every year. Will they update the Steam Machine every couple of years, or will they decrease the price? I have to assume they are targeting a neutral price because their primary goal is to assemble a linux box with as little margin as possible and put it in front of you for an actual fair price, but “fair price” is a moving target.
Personally, I’m all for getting what I pay for. People who sell to you at a loss are up to something.
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They’re letting us discuss this ad nauseam just to understand what prices people consider acceptable for these devices
It’s a good idea, tout the market before doing anything controversial
100%
But that’s not a terrible thing, I suppose.
Fair pricing means a reasonable profit on the base cost. Trying to gauge what people are willing to pay means that you want to maximise your profit at all costs, consumers be damned.
I understand that’s what Americans consider “fair”, but I don’t fully agree.
The top end Steam Deck was like $750 at release. Replace the screen with better CPU and GPU, and there’s your baseline for the Machine. Since it’s “6x” performance, price will probably be a bit higher. People thinking way less are smoking crack.
How many of you have actually had a Linux PC connected to your living room TV? I built one about 13 years ago (and upgraded the guts occasionally) and it’s been awesome. With a regular web browser you can watch YouTube (with uBlock of course), Plex/Jellyfin, or any streaming service, in addition to gaming. Plus I’ve done stuff like vacation planning with my partner, where we can easily bring up maps and hotel listings from our couch without hunching over a laptop or tablet.
While Linux hardware support is quite good these days, there’s still something to be said for buying a machine that you know is fully supported and targeted by game devs.
I’m happily running an Intel NUC as TV computer since 2013, and it’s awesome for exactly the reasons you state. I invested in it when I realized how fully crap the “smart” features of my Samsung TV are. The ultimate controller for it is a combo keyboard and touchpad, I have the Logitech K400r.
The NUC is starting to show it’s age now with its 4th gen i5, and I’m in the process of replacing it with a mini PC with an Intel N100.
Just set this up after the whole windows 10 support drop thing, and holy shit!!! This is awesome! Not only no ads but I can Strawhat everything! Just got a figure out how to do this for my phone now
Had a Windows PC hooked up to my TV in I think 2008, before streaming boxes and mass adoption of Netflix. Then it was dualboot for a while starting in I think 2015, originally with Ubuntu. Now it’s full time CachyOS Linux as of 2023.
It’s always been great. Wireless keyboard with the built in trackpad, plus originally 360 controllers but now 8BitDo Ultimate controllers. Plus I use it for homelab tinkering.
Same, but I’m much more recent. Got a rpi 5 running Arch. Been happy with it for 2-3 years now
I know speculation is fun, but until we know the price officially, all of this is moot. Wait until next year when they announce actual pricing and judge it then for its value.
I, personally, don’t think it’ll be a successful product if it isn’t less than $800. They don’t have to have it cost console prices, but it does need to be at least somewhat within spitting distance. If the price is the cost of an Xbox or Playstation plus, say…a year of their online service subscription, I think that could be marketable.
If it’s closer to a grand, it’ll be a flop like the first Steam Machines.
Even at 1000$ it will most likely outperform any 1000$ prebuilt you can buy. If they market it like this it can absolutely work at that price point.
I went to PCPartPicker and tried to assemble a similarly spec’d PC, not with the absolute cheapest components, but definitely from the lower end sorted by price, it came out close to $800.
I guess if Valve can price it at that and be smaller it might have a market, but if much more than that people are better off just buying a PC.
P.S. Since Valve is not buying retail I think there is room for lower than that, and it’d definitely be welcome, but I’m not sure Valve will make that decision.
2x8 GB RAM for 130 dollars? What the fuck? I knew theyve gotten more expensive recently but that stings.
PCPartPicker has a general price tracker where you can see how much RAM has spiked in such a short time. It really emphasizes how crazy things have gotten
“more expensive” really is underselling it. It’s out of control. Some kits have tripled.
Yep. Everthing had at least doubled in the past ~ two months, because Nvidia’s AI bubble must not be allowed to pop.
Brother it’s so bad. I’ve been trying to help a friend do one recently, or at least plan it, and I’ve watched my previously $85 2x16 sticks of GSkill DDR5 (like the cheapest option I had) shoot up to like $260 in under a month has been insane. It’s not even good ram…
I recently (a few months ago) built a new high-end server for my homelab, and bought 512GB of DDR4 ECC RAM for around $510. I just looked it up, and those exact same modules are around $2.5k to $3.5k for the same amount. That’s more than I paid for the entire machine.
In the same boat actually. Helping a friend with a build and RAM is ridiculous right now. crappy slower 2x16 kits costing $350 and far beyond. Their desired upper end CPU is less than most RAM kits. I was trying to find a middle ground for them with 2x24 but I can’t even find those kits anymore. Doesn’t help that these days 32 is recommended for some games, let alone aminimum for productivity software. I got lucky when I built. Prices were bad (~150 for 2x24!!) but shot up not even days after I built last month and my kit hasn’t even been in stock since I got it.
This bubble can’t burst soon enough…
A friend of mine just dropped $700 on 2x64Gb for his upcoming editing rig. Most expensive part of the build.
That’s insanity lol
Yeah, the AI (manufactured) hype has caused RAM prices to skyrocket thanks to them buying out ALL the fucking RAM for those servers.
That’s almost the Apple fee
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hLiwNViMak
YouTube channel Moore’s law is dead priced it out at $425 including controller. For cost not price.
It would cost me about a grand to make a pc that still not up to par with a ps5 where I live.
Quick question, can you buy a pc and run the same OS and version of steam that this pc they built uses? Im assuming its the same as steam deck. Just wondering if you could build it exactly the same outside just installing steam.
No.
They haven’t released the current version of SteamOS to be installed on any machine and imaging the actual Deck’s OS won’t work on all hardware. You could do the old steam machine OS; but it is not anywhere the same as what the Deck and this new Steam Machine use other than being based on Linux.
There is Bazzite, though, which is not the same OS, but strives to offer the same experience.
They have released the recovery image for the deck, which can be installed on any computer and if you have AMD built pc, it should work just fine. Ofc ymmv.
Sure.
I have a cheap $250 AMD APU based mini pc I bought off Amazon running SteamOS. I just used the Steam Deck restore USB image to install it. I imagine you could use the Steam Machine image the same way when its available.
You can, technically, but there are some caveats.
SteamOS is not a general purpose OS. It is optimized to run on the Steam Deck (plus the Frame and Gabecube I guess). Its software components are tested on a limited range of hardware (specifically AMD silicon), and it might not have certain optimizations and compatibility fixes that are required by other consumer hardware. It also probably has some proprietary bits, especially the firmware.
The best option is Bazzite. It’s not based on SteamOS, but it is built with a robust gaming experience in focus. You can even get it to boot directly into Steam Big Picture. Watch this loud Aussie man do it!
The other option is HoloISO, which is an independent reimplementation of SteamOS. Their intention is to get as close to the real SteamOS as possible. Hardware support is limited (especially nvidia).
Popping in to champion bazzite, it’s my daily use os and I’ve never found an os that’s as easy and clean to run. So far the only issue I’ve had is that it doesn’t support some laptop wifi cards out of the box.
You can do this now. But it’ll probably be more effort than using something like Bazzite. The image is available publicly. It just assumes a certain set of hardware (AMD GPU, for example). It might be enough to install the GPU drivers you need. Worst case, you might have to recompile the kernel. But all the user space configuration should be fine.
https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/65B4-2AA3-5F37-4227
Remember, an Xbox series X now costs $600 for digital edition ($800 for 2tb + disk drive)
…and those are just flying off the shelves!
It’s $2,400 – 6 Steam Decks – the end.
Where am I supposed to be able to get $3,600 to buy this?
Sell your csgo skins
You have two kidneys, don’t you?
SLPT: Drug dealing. You can make a lot of money in a short amount of time
That’s ULPT, not SLPT, because there is a profit to be madm
And its recession proof!
Think about it this way, people. Yes, it may be more expensive than a PlayStation. However, Steam offers numerous deals several times a year, so it will be worth the investment. In the long run, owning a Steam Machine or PC will pay for itself.
Unfortunately, due to the craze of AI server farms, PC parts are becoming more expensive. For example, the price of RAM has doubled, and analysts say that SSDs will suffer the same fate.
The real question is if Valve plans to swallow the jumps in price. They must have designed the machine before the price hikes, so I wonder if they already had a price in mind and whether they’re gonna stick to it.
And you also don’t have to pay monthly for multiplayer!
That too!
I think this geared toward the crowd that plays games, but doesn’t have the latest and greatest hardware nor likes to tinker. This will be an upgrade for a lot of people and the ability to just set it up and play your already existing backlog with ease is the main selling point over power.
It’s an awesome device which will help drive the Linux gaming ecosystem forward, but it’s not for me personally as it doesn’t hold a candle to my PC.
Ofcourse it will. Anyone expecting any less are just optimists
Maybe we will all benefit if the 14 year old kids gets a steam machine, instead of some cheap pos with loads of errors, slowness etc = extra rage in games.
Why would anyone want it then? Just install Steam on your machine and use it…
“on your machine” requires you to have a machine. This isn’t for people with computers already. This is for people who are already looking for a new machine, and this becomes the “ready out of the box” option.
If its a decent price I’ll want it. I love the freedom PC gaming allows but sometimes I do miss the convenience of a console. It would be great for my kid as well. No fidling with the display, having the PC not wake properly from sleep, controllers not connecting, etc. It would just work. Our current setup inevitably something doesnt work right first try.
As it says in the article, it’ll be smaller and quieter, so less offensive for most people’s living rooms than a full-size desktop. It’s not meant to replace your existing PC if you have one, unless it was getting old and you were about to replace it anyway. If you don’t have a PC, or don’t have one in the living room, then it might be a better option than anyone else’s prebuilt.
And, as with any standardized hardware, it’s a lot easier to ensure games and services (like Proton) perform reliably.
Time will tell if this sells enough, but it could become the new standard for industry benchmarking/testing.
Exactly. We are already seeing game companies specifically mention the Steam Deck in patch notes. This will give them a standard item to validate compatibility against. Any game company that wants to make sure their game works well will have a Steam Machine on-hand to QA with.
And I fully agree with you on benchmarking. It will be a very standardized system to point to in game reviews.
The biggest advantages it has over other PCs is CEC and Wake on USB(controller) enabled out of the box. Those are the two features I miss the most on my HTPC.
Other major advantages are the form factor and standardized design making it smaller and most likely more reliable than a comparable PC.
There are people who exist between “I build, format and otherwise manage my own gaming rig,” and “I don’t need a PC for games.”
My partner is a perfect example. She has my old PC shell, with some $500 of GPU, internal memory, and accessories, hooked up to the TV. She uses it daily, almost exclusively for Steam games and streaming services that she finds more comfortable to navigate with a keyboard and mouse. A smaller, quieter, streamlined, “this more or less will do the things you want to do straight out of the box” product would have saved both her (and I, because that thing has had some troubleshooting) a lot of headache, while looking far more presentable to boot.
Maybe she’s the odd one out and the target audience is more niche than my bias’ recognize, but I guess we’ll see for sure when this thing releases.
At least for me, a Steam Machine would be the ideal use case for my brother, since the literal ONLY game he plays is CS2. He used to play Fortnite, but he hasn’t done that in years… and even then if he wanted we could just swap places between my current real computer and the Steam Machine. It’s also really small so it wouldn’t occupy much space on the other room of the house.
I mean, it’s fine to do so, as long as you have PC hardware that meets your needs. Valve would be fine with it too. As long as it can run Steam, all good. For Valve, I expect that the Steam Machine is to provide an easy-to-set-up option a la consoles that let them move into the living room for people who have an issue with that. If you can already use/configure a PC and have one, then that option is gonna work too.
People without gaming rigs that don’t wanna spend almost as much for a console
I don’t understand. Why pay the same for the same power just to get a less maintainable machine that is barely usable outside gaming?
How is it barely usable outside gaming? Its a fully functional Linux desktop computer
I used Linux for regular desktop stuff before I installed Steam on it. Steam got me back into gaming.
Almost same, I use Linux on my laptop for regular stuff and just have a console.
Now suddenly valve has made steam and almost all gaming Linux native! I definitely want one lol
Why is it barely usable outside of gaming?
That’s a lot for someone who doesn’t understand computers beyond Windows and MacOS. People also don’t realise that since the PS4 and the Xbox One every console is just a X86-64 machine. So, I think it’s a good move from Valve. Also it will be easier to manage and optimise for Valve if all their hardware is the same, a bit like Apple.
People do occasionally buy new computers, and this one looks likely to be a better choice than most of what’s on the market.
That sucks. I hoped Valve would price it competitively to boost the sales and adoption. But why would I buy this “crippled” PC for the same price I can buy retail? The main gripe for me is Gabecube has no room for upgrade, not even second drive, nothing. Which obviously is not the case with self built PC.
Don’t get me wrong I still like the idea, but the price just must make sense.
why do you think it’ll be crippled?
I mean crippled like it is “as is”, no space to expand, tinker, swap parts. I’ve also seen a rumor it’ll have locked BIOS, but I hope that’s just a rumor.
Thanks all the same Valve. For 900 or more, you can keep it. We’re good. 👍
Over, under
$500 USD?
Definitely over 500$. Considering the statement it sounds like it will be at least 800 dollars.
Yeah, I’ve been guessing $800-1000. That’s a decent deal on a prebuilt with this performance.
IIRC from an earlier article, they’re still looking at factors and don’t yet know for sure (I suspect that it might be that Trump tariffs and whether they will stand is an input).
I’m curious to see how the price will be affected as consumer PCs get stronger every year. Will they update the Steam Machine every couple of years, or will they decrease the price? I have to assume they are targeting a neutral price because their primary goal is to assemble a linux box with as little margin as possible and put it in front of you for an actual fair price, but “fair price” is a moving target.
Personally, I’m all for getting what I pay for. People who sell to you at a loss are up to something.