Wow this is terrible news. Basically Paradox owns the IP to Cities Skylines and Colossal Order seemingly want out.
I’d say a large reason CS2 has been such a mess is because it was rushed out, the paradox mod system is just not fit for purpose and there remains a ridiculous focus on getting the console version released + move on to DLCs rather than fixing the main game. I’d put most of the blame on Paradox’s shoulders to be honest.
It’ll be interesting to see what CO does next. CS1 was a great game, CS2 could have been a great game. Will they do another city sim or more onto something else? Seems a shame if they move on as they have grown so much expertise in the genre. I’m hoping they’re cutting free to do a game with their own vision, which was how CS1 came to be.
Apropos of nothing more than my idle speculation, I’d guess they will return to the transport tycoon genre if they are able to do so. Before Skylines took the crown from SimCity as the preeminent example of the genre, they made the Cities in Motion games, which were narrowly focused on improving the mass transit of existing cities (as opposed to building the city itself). I know the second CiM game had some interaction between the city and your efforts as transportation czar (in the same way you could indirectly influence a citiy’s development in, say Railroad Tycoon), but the emphasis was always on transit. I imagine the newly independent team will want to keep their focus narrow, unless another publisher swoops in to replace the safety net.
Huge player of Cities in Motion 1/2. I still play both of them to this day.
Cities in Motion 2’s city building elements were basically a prototype for Cities Skylines. The look and feel are very similar (of course CiM2 didn’t really have city-building management layer, just public transit).
On one hand I’m happy its dead because paradox deserves this. But on the other hand I spent $80 on this and I really thought it had the base to be an amazing game.
Latest developments makes it seem like Krafton just wanted to save the cash to plow into their lame AI venture.
I mean honestly, when has a video game company actually been on the right side when things came to a head with the founders?
“The termination notices of the founders gave one reason for their termination,” said Fortis, “and that was the supposed lack of readiness of Subanutica 2 for release. Krafton reiterated that basis for its actions repeatedly.”
Fortis called it a “seismic shift in the case” and “a little bit bewildering”. This was also echoed by the judge, Lori W. Will, when the parties met for a ruling on the filed motions, saying: “Well, that’s something that we definitely need to get to the bottom of today, because that is precisely what was cited as the reason in the answer.”
Krafton’s representatives were not clear about why this argument has been taken off the table, only that it has been, and that it’s no longer why they are saying the founders were terminated.
Instead, Krafton is focusing on the argument that the founders “abandoned their posts” and “deceived” their employer. Causing more confusion is the accusation that the founders downloaded files and kept devices with confidential information on them. This only came to light after the termination, so its relevance has been questioned.
Nothing about PUBG and Subnautica 2 publisher Krafton’s recent decision to become an “AI-first company” look good. The company plans to drop over 130 billion won ($88 million) into the project, recently stopped hiring new employees, and started a voluntary resignation program for its employees in South Korea this week.
Far down the ladder from these decisions is Eleventh Hour Games, the developer behind Last Epoch, which Krafton acquired in July. The timing couldn’t have been worse as it happened right after the founders of Subnautica developer Unknown Worlds were unceremoniously fired for what they claim was a move to avoid paying a $250 million earnout.
There’s been a ton of back and forth finger pointing but the more I hear about it (and other news about Krafton), the more my gut tells me that Krafton are the bad guys.
I mean it’s pretty obvious they are. The original reason Krafton gave for firing the founders was that Subnautica 2 was being pushed out before it was ready just so the founders could get their bonuses.
Krafton has since dropped those arguments in the legal fillings and changed their reason for firing them to some nebulous shit like:
“abandoned their posts” and “deceived” their employer.
I mean come on. This isn’t even a both sides issue anymore.
The original reason Krafton gave for firing the founders was that Subnautica 2 was being pushed out before it was ready just so the founders could get their bonuses.
No, it’s pretty one-sided. The game was ready for a soft launch by the expected date. They even have communications exchanges between Krafton’s CEO and their global ops head how to avoid paying out the bonus before firing them.
“Krafton terminated the Founders and seized control of Unknown Worlds in order to avoid the earnout,” reads the group’s latest filing. “Smoking gun documents show that Krafton was looking for ways to ‘cancel the earn-out’ and that its secret ‘Project X’ was designed to either make a ‘Deal’ on the earnout or execute a “Take over.” When the Founders would not agree to Krafton’s demands related to the earnout, Krafton decided a ‘take over’ would be the ‘easier’ route.”
I loved CS1 and have had CS2 since launch. I just can’t get into CS2 - it’s just not fun.
A large part of that is Paradox Mods in CS2. When CS1 launched from day one you could go onto the steam workshop and download player made models - houses, offices, train stations, roads etc. It grew rapidly and continuously, and it meant every city you made you could customise and change. The game was constantly refreshing and fun, and you could make whatever you wanted.
For CS2, 2 years on and you still can’t add custom assets to the game. Paradox/CO have released themed region based asset packs that they have made and the mods are there, but the player made assets remain largely missing. And I suspect the reason is Paradox Mods and the upcoming console version - the PC version seems to have been held back from being good so Paradox can get it’s console launch. There seems to be a fundamental lack of understanding that the player made content was what made CS1 so great. I suspect CO get that, while Paradox only cares about DLC.
It’s weird, there is a long history of these kinds of games getting a console release going all the way back to SimCity for Super Nintendo. IIRC it could optionally use the Mario Paint mouse.
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Wow this is terrible news. Basically Paradox owns the IP to Cities Skylines and Colossal Order seemingly want out.
I’d say a large reason CS2 has been such a mess is because it was rushed out, the paradox mod system is just not fit for purpose and there remains a ridiculous focus on getting the console version released + move on to DLCs rather than fixing the main game. I’d put most of the blame on Paradox’s shoulders to be honest.
It’ll be interesting to see what CO does next. CS1 was a great game, CS2 could have been a great game. Will they do another city sim or more onto something else? Seems a shame if they move on as they have grown so much expertise in the genre. I’m hoping they’re cutting free to do a game with their own vision, which was how CS1 came to be.
Apropos of nothing more than my idle speculation, I’d guess they will return to the transport tycoon genre if they are able to do so. Before Skylines took the crown from SimCity as the preeminent example of the genre, they made the Cities in Motion games, which were narrowly focused on improving the mass transit of existing cities (as opposed to building the city itself). I know the second CiM game had some interaction between the city and your efforts as transportation czar (in the same way you could indirectly influence a citiy’s development in, say Railroad Tycoon), but the emphasis was always on transit. I imagine the newly independent team will want to keep their focus narrow, unless another publisher swoops in to replace the safety net.
Huge player of Cities in Motion 1/2. I still play both of them to this day.
Cities in Motion 2’s city building elements were basically a prototype for Cities Skylines. The look and feel are very similar (of course CiM2 didn’t really have city-building management layer, just public transit).
They likely signed noncompete contracts so they can’t make a different game of the same genre.
Cities XS
On one hand I’m happy its dead because paradox deserves this. But on the other hand I spent $80 on this and I really thought it had the base to be an amazing game.
I spent 60 dollars and I played 4 hours, lol.
I just cant bring myself to launch the game, its so slow, laggy and boring… :/
So they are doing a Kerbal Space Program to Cities Skylines… Did they not see how badly that went?
With Subnautica 2 we will get the trifecta.
Maaaaan. Fuck Krafton.
Do we know who was to blame for that? Last I heard, the publisher and the developers were pointing fingers at each other.
Latest developments makes it seem like Krafton just wanted to save the cash to plow into their lame AI venture.
I mean honestly, when has a video game company actually been on the right side when things came to a head with the founders?
https://www.pcgamer.com/games/survival-crafting/the-subnautica-2-lawsuit-is-getting-even-messier-with-krafton-doing-a-massive-u-turn-confusing-both-the-ousted-founders-lawyer-and-the-judge-this-is-a-little-bit-bewildering/
Shortly after came this announcement 🙄
https://www.pcgamer.com/games/rpg/as-krafton-evolves-into-an-ai-first-company-the-boss-of-the-recently-acquired-last-epoch-studio-says-he-doesnt-think-the-doom-and-gloom-is-warranted/
There’s been a ton of back and forth finger pointing but the more I hear about it (and other news about Krafton), the more my gut tells me that Krafton are the bad guys.
I mean it’s pretty obvious they are. The original reason Krafton gave for firing the founders was that Subnautica 2 was being pushed out before it was ready just so the founders could get their bonuses.
Krafton has since dropped those arguments in the legal fillings and changed their reason for firing them to some nebulous shit like:
I mean come on. This isn’t even a both sides issue anymore.
https://www.pcgamer.com/games/survival-crafting/the-subnautica-2-lawsuit-is-getting-even-messier-with-krafton-doing-a-massive-u-turn-confusing-both-the-ousted-founders-lawyer-and-the-judge-this-is-a-little-bit-bewildering/
Neither sides of that look good.
No, it’s pretty one-sided. The game was ready for a soft launch by the expected date. They even have communications exchanges between Krafton’s CEO and their global ops head how to avoid paying out the bonus before firing them.
https://kotaku.com/subnautica-2-krafton-lawsuit-chatgpt-2000644792
Dean Hall waiting to announce Kitties Skyllines
Fuck Paradox, such a pathetic publisher.
I like their first party games, not so much their published games. They should stick to what they do best.
AOW4 being the one exception for me.
I was close to buying it during a free demo and sale recently. Then I read the reviews. This news just solidified me never buying it.
I loved CS1 and have had CS2 since launch. I just can’t get into CS2 - it’s just not fun.
A large part of that is Paradox Mods in CS2. When CS1 launched from day one you could go onto the steam workshop and download player made models - houses, offices, train stations, roads etc. It grew rapidly and continuously, and it meant every city you made you could customise and change. The game was constantly refreshing and fun, and you could make whatever you wanted.
For CS2, 2 years on and you still can’t add custom assets to the game. Paradox/CO have released themed region based asset packs that they have made and the mods are there, but the player made assets remain largely missing. And I suspect the reason is Paradox Mods and the upcoming console version - the PC version seems to have been held back from being good so Paradox can get it’s console launch. There seems to be a fundamental lack of understanding that the player made content was what made CS1 so great. I suspect CO get that, while Paradox only cares about DLC.
Wait… Who plays these games on console? I feel they need the mouse to have any sort ability to control.
It’s weird, there is a long history of these kinds of games getting a console release going all the way back to SimCity for Super Nintendo. IIRC it could optionally use the Mario Paint mouse.
I am so glad I gave up on Paradox.
Hopefully, CO can make some cool economic strategy games without Paradox’s involvement.
I’m the complete opposite. I can’t stand Steam workshop, and greatly prefer Paradox mods
Why do you think Paradox is better?
Because it’s a ton easier to make playsets and turn mods on and off
I get that, playsets is a feature that I would welcome to the Workshop. You can kinda do it with collections, but that’s not as smooth
Between this and the Subnautica news, it hasn’t been a good year for highly anticipated indi-games going mainstream.
This sucks. I really like CS2, but there’s no way this will be a good thing.
yea. RIP