Battery life, Android ecosystem is actually designed for a smaller form factor, cost. Wither or not these are good enough reasons are personal, but there are reasons.
Do you have any studies for that? From what I can tell phones and portable devices are all running ARM and even small laptops have been switching to ARM.
There isn’t really any inherent part about ARM that is more power efficient that x86 can’t really achieve if they really want to. You’re not gonna find studies on this because it’s not really something you can make studies on about but you can read up on CPU architecture design, CISC vs RISC debates to see that the reason why ARM seems to be more power efficient is due to a bunch of other reasons. Chips and Cheese has a really good article on this but it gets very technical.
Could also look at AMD’s Z series CPUs and Intel’s Lunar Lake and upcoming Panther Lake processors.
Yes, but also no. It does use the Linux kernel, but userspace is very different. The application ecosystem is very different. There can be huge differences between distros let alone a linux distro and android…
I’d just like to interject for a moment. What you’re refering to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I’ve recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.
Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called Linux, and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.
There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine’s resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called Linux distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux!
Basically outside of the steam deck all x86 devices are large and cost $1000. However, android gaming devices have a wide range of form factors (clamshell, dual screen, etc) ranging from $200-$800ish.
In my experience, support is nowhere near steam deck (maybe half, if that) and you aren’t going to be playing many 3D games, but it’s great for indie titles.
So if you’re looking for a smaller form factor to play indie games (including some older/lightweight 3D games) on the cheaper side, the android handhelds are an interesting option.
I agree this device may not be worth it, but as I said other arm devices with the same capability and different form factors cost anywhere from $200-800 and have their own pros and cons.
Okay, I should have said similar, but you seem to just not want to acknowledge that there is a space/demand for these kinds of products.
Show me a non arm $200 range product that can run games like mewgenics, deadcells, megabonk, etc. The closest I can think of is a Nintendo switch, but that has a more limited (and expensive) library and will start losing support as the more expensive switch 2 takes over.
Why would you use an ARM/Android device to emulate x86/>Linux instead of the opposite?
My responses were answering your initial question.
If you’re asking, why buy this specific $600 device, then I agree with you, it seems inferior to a steam deck by most metrics (compatability and performance being the biggest issues).
Nvidia, Intel and AMD: their business now is circular money with AI and not PC gaming industry anymore.
I don’t see how ARM, especially when Qualcomm is the only realistic option, is the solution here. Also, basic x86-64 patents have lapsed last year and newer extensions will lapse step by step. ARM64 is still so new, its initial patents will only lapse in 10 years.
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But y tho
Why would you use an ARM/Android device to emulate x86/Linux instead of the opposite?
Battery life, Android ecosystem is actually designed for a smaller form factor, cost. Wither or not these are good enough reasons are personal, but there are reasons.
There’s really not much of an advantage in efficiency with ARM anymore, but there is a huge loss in peak performance.
Do you have any studies for that? From what I can tell phones and portable devices are all running ARM and even small laptops have been switching to ARM.
Not scientific ones,but they shouldn’t be necessary. Look up the Panther Lake battery tests.
There isn’t really any inherent part about ARM that is more power efficient that x86 can’t really achieve if they really want to. You’re not gonna find studies on this because it’s not really something you can make studies on about but you can read up on CPU architecture design, CISC vs RISC debates to see that the reason why ARM seems to be more power efficient is due to a bunch of other reasons. Chips and Cheese has a really good article on this but it gets very technical.
Could also look at AMD’s Z series CPUs and Intel’s Lunar Lake and upcoming Panther Lake processors.
Android is Linux
Yes, but also no. It does use the Linux kernel, but userspace is very different. The application ecosystem is very different. There can be huge differences between distros let alone a linux distro and android…
Alpine Linux has a very different user space from GNU/Linux. It’s still Linux.
And also has nothing to do with Android.
sigh say the thing!
Anyone who says “Linux” means GNU/Linux and anyone who says Android means Android/Linux.
I’d just like to interject for a moment. What you’re refering to as Linux, is in fact, GNU/Linux, or as I’ve recently taken to calling it, GNU plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning GNU system made useful by the GNU corelibs, shell utilities and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.
Many computer users run a modified version of the GNU system every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of GNU which is widely used today is often called Linux, and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the GNU system, developed by the GNU Project.
There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine’s resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with the GNU operating system: the whole system is basically GNU with Linux added, or GNU/Linux. All the so-called Linux distributions are really distributions of GNU/Linux!
What makes GNU/Linux? glibc! What about glibc is not optimized for “smaller form factor, cost”?
Basically outside of the steam deck all x86 devices are large and cost $1000. However, android gaming devices have a wide range of form factors (clamshell, dual screen, etc) ranging from $200-$800ish.
In my experience, support is nowhere near steam deck (maybe half, if that) and you aren’t going to be playing many 3D games, but it’s great for indie titles.
So if you’re looking for a smaller form factor to play indie games (including some older/lightweight 3D games) on the cheaper side, the android handhelds are an interesting option.
Then get a Steam Deck (when they’re back in stock). This thing is $600, which is more than a Steam Deck.
I agree this device may not be worth it, but as I said other arm devices with the same capability and different form factors cost anywhere from $200-800 and have their own pros and cons.
A $200 device does not have the same capabilities.
Okay, I should have said similar, but you seem to just not want to acknowledge that there is a space/demand for these kinds of products.
Show me a non arm $200 range product that can run games like mewgenics, deadcells, megabonk, etc. The closest I can think of is a Nintendo switch, but that has a more limited (and expensive) library and will start losing support as the more expensive switch 2 takes over.
I have no doubt that there’s demand for all kinds of stupid shit. The question is if it’s stupid, which this appears to be to me.
There aren’t any $200 x86 handheld devices that I’m aware of, but that’s not what we’re discussing. This is a $600 device.
Your initial question was:
My responses were answering your initial question.
If you’re asking, why buy this specific $600 device, then I agree with you, it seems inferior to a steam deck by most metrics (compatability and performance being the biggest issues).
Nvidia, Intel and AMD: their business now is circular money with AI and not PC gaming industry anymore.
Er, and you think ARM is somehow not involved?
I don’t see how ARM, especially when Qualcomm is the only realistic option, is the solution here. Also, basic x86-64 patents have lapsed last year and newer extensions will lapse step by step. ARM64 is still so new, its initial patents will only lapse in 10 years.
What does AI have to do with this? It’s a Qualcomm chip, not made by any of those companies.
That’s their point.
Huh?
They are saying the fact that Qualcomm isn’t involved with AI stuff (at least not yet in a big way) is a reason to buy their stuff.