I meant that in legal sense they pirate stuff. Copyright laws being goofy is another thing entirely but Nintendo works in a legal framework where not defending your trademarks means you can lose them.
Nintendo couldn’t pirate their own stuff because they own it. They downloaded ROMs because they can’t be arsed to dump them themselves, similar to 99% of population. Kind of hypocritical with all the DRM related laws that they support but at least they recognise they’re unenforceable.
Ok, then Nintendo benefitted financially from piracy and made no efforts to hide the fact that they obtained games through the exact same methods that pirates use.
Man, I pirate stuff all the time, I just don’t like people making up things to explain themselves, especially if I know they can afford stuff they pirate.
Yes, if it’s old or you can’t afford it then just get it. Copyright, trademark and patent laws are a joke and it’s a sensible way to revolt over them.
Latest Nintendo dealings with Switch emulation give me mixed feelings. Yuzu was obviously benefitting monetarily (Patreon) from encouraging piracy (showing games before their release). Fuck those guys. Nintendo shouldn’t have gone after Ryujinx though and I’m quite angry about it.
I don’t dispute imaginary statistics, there’s no point.
And if that were true, it makes no difference. Nintendo meticulously goes after fan projects and emulators that are completely legal. If they want to go after sites distributing ROMs - totally fair.
Saying Nintendo is only anti-consumer to pirates is a bootlicker take.
Nintendo went against one emulator that was legal, Ryujinx, and I support critiquing Nintendo for this. In other instances they were going after pirates and people infringing on their currently used trademarks and copyrights.
The Yuzu team was profiting from game leaks and piracy, and that’s illegal. Their software was not illegal. Nintendo’s lawsuit was riddled with bullshit claims about circumventing encryption and other made-up offenses, and resulted in the 100% legal development of both Yuzu and Citra being forcefully terminated. The actually just solution would have been to forbid them from monetizing their projects by promising fixes for unreleased software.
Here’s a simple analogy: if you own a 3D printer and sell objects made with that printer, some of which are illegal for whatever reason (e.g. parts for making untraceable firearms), should a court forbid you from ever using a 3D printer ever again, even if it’s to make a kickstand for your tablet, or should it forbid you from making illegal parts only?
Yuzu devs are gone from the scene but the source code is out there. Turns out developing an emulator requires a team of full time employees that you need to fund through Patreon and that’s kinda far beyond a hobby project, no? You’re so anti Nintendo that you started cheering for another company that was outright infringing on their IP by using Nintendo trademarks in their own marketing materials.
Snes9x, no$gba, Higan and literally dozens if not hundreds of other emulators were developed as hobby projects, many of them by a single person in their spare time, so you, sir or madam, are completely full of it. Go fanboy somewhere else and let the grown-ups talk.
Development of a cutting edge emulator takes effort because you can’t brute force your way. It has to be efficient and also incredibly complex (all modern emulators are HAL or API reimplementations by necessity). Those emulators you reference didn’t require commercial amount of funding because they were created by the time emulated hardware was obsolete. It was a nice balance where Nintendo didn’t sue anyone. That is until Yuzu/Citra folks decided to enrich themselves in the process, bring Sauron Nintendo gaze and ruin things for everyone.
I’m fairly certain that Ryujinx is a hobby project as well, which would contradict your claim that developing emulators for later-gen systems requires funding. However, I may be mistaken.
Regardless of if I am right about Ryujinx, your claim that I am “cheering for another company” just because I called a spade a spade with regards to Nintendo’s legal trickery in the Yuzu case is still wrong. As I said, the Yuzu team was wrong to profit off of adding patches for leaked games. They deserved to get their Patreon shut down for that. However, the sentence forbade them from ever working on a Nintendo emulator again, which is excessive because developing an emulator is not and should not be illegal.
For another example that might clarify my position: I believe that Palworld is in many ways a blatant rip-off of Pokémon IP that obviously marketed itself on its similarities with Nintendo’s franchise. Nintendo was quite right to sue them. However, the lawsuit evoked patents whose very existence is the epitome of bullshit, such as using a drawn outline to represent the position of a player character or NPC who is totally or partially obscured behind an opaque object. This is an obvious solution, and one of the requirements for a patent is that it be non-obvious.
We live in a complex world. It is possible to be in the right and still be an unethical overreaching asshole about it.
Ryujinx got caught in a crossfire. I’m pretty sure Nintendo wouldn’t dare to harass them, similar to Dolphin, if it wasn’t for all the publicity Yuzu was bringing to Switch piracy. Nintendo shouldn’t have done that but here we are and it’s Yuzu that started this by breaking unwritten rules and playing dumb.
Yuzu was a commercial enterprise. The moment you start taking money for this kind of work it’s no longer a hobby project and should bear all of the legal consequences. Yuzu guys were smart, they played a scrappy underdog but if your whole business idea hinges on breaking multiple laws for the purpose of making money (and they made much more than covering current expenses) you’re asking for trouble. They also enjoy a bit of a revenge from the grave with all the people angry over their toys being taken away doing black PR for Nintendo. Everyone is free to do as they please but what I’m seeing is just a hissy fit so there isn’t that much nuance to this.
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100% agree. Also 99% emulator users pirate games or do you dispute this part too?
They pirate THEIR OWN GAMES and emulate them using software other people made! No excuse!
How can Nintendo pirate a thing they own?
Using someone else’s rip as their own software
So they pirated the act of piracy? What’s the law against that?
How else do you need this explained? They stole someone else’s software and SOLD IT pretending it’s their own.
If you did that, do you think that’s legal?
Which software is someone else’s here?
If you think that’s illegal why nobody is suing?
Do you mean pirating games that are still for sale? Because plenty of emulator users only pirate old stuff that isn’t currently for sale.
I meant that in legal sense they pirate stuff. Copyright laws being goofy is another thing entirely but Nintendo works in a legal framework where not defending your trademarks means you can lose them.
It’s probably almost nearly 100% of emulator users who pirate games.
Even Nintendo pirated their own games before releasing them on the Wii’s Virtual Console.
Nintendo couldn’t pirate their own stuff because they own it. They downloaded ROMs because they can’t be arsed to dump them themselves, similar to 99% of population. Kind of hypocritical with all the DRM related laws that they support but at least they recognise they’re unenforceable.
Ok, then Nintendo benefitted financially from piracy and made no efforts to hide the fact that they obtained games through the exact same methods that pirates use.
Piracy of what?
Booty and gold, of course
What did they pirate specifically and why nobody is suing them for it? Please go ahead.
Eh, I would suspect that a majority of games “pirated” are game you can’t buy anymore (ot at least not realistically).
Also is it pirating if I can’t find my copy of the game anymore?
Man, I pirate stuff all the time, I just don’t like people making up things to explain themselves, especially if I know they can afford stuff they pirate.
Yes, if it’s old or you can’t afford it then just get it. Copyright, trademark and patent laws are a joke and it’s a sensible way to revolt over them.
Latest Nintendo dealings with Switch emulation give me mixed feelings. Yuzu was obviously benefitting monetarily (Patreon) from encouraging piracy (showing games before their release). Fuck those guys. Nintendo shouldn’t have gone after Ryujinx though and I’m quite angry about it.
I don’t dispute imaginary statistics, there’s no point.
And if that were true, it makes no difference. Nintendo meticulously goes after fan projects and emulators that are completely legal. If they want to go after sites distributing ROMs - totally fair.
Saying Nintendo is only anti-consumer to pirates is a bootlicker take.
Nintendo went against one emulator that was legal, Ryujinx, and I support critiquing Nintendo for this. In other instances they were going after pirates and people infringing on their currently used trademarks and copyrights.
You are completely wrong.
The Yuzu team was profiting from game leaks and piracy, and that’s illegal. Their software was not illegal. Nintendo’s lawsuit was riddled with bullshit claims about circumventing encryption and other made-up offenses, and resulted in the 100% legal development of both Yuzu and Citra being forcefully terminated. The actually just solution would have been to forbid them from monetizing their projects by promising fixes for unreleased software.
Here’s a simple analogy: if you own a 3D printer and sell objects made with that printer, some of which are illegal for whatever reason (e.g. parts for making untraceable firearms), should a court forbid you from ever using a 3D printer ever again, even if it’s to make a kickstand for your tablet, or should it forbid you from making illegal parts only?
Yuzu devs are gone from the scene but the source code is out there. Turns out developing an emulator requires a team of full time employees that you need to fund through Patreon and that’s kinda far beyond a hobby project, no? You’re so anti Nintendo that you started cheering for another company that was outright infringing on their IP by using Nintendo trademarks in their own marketing materials.
Snes9x, no$gba, Higan and literally dozens if not hundreds of other emulators were developed as hobby projects, many of them by a single person in their spare time, so you, sir or madam, are completely full of it. Go fanboy somewhere else and let the grown-ups talk.
I’m fairly certain you missed the point.
Development of a cutting edge emulator takes effort because you can’t brute force your way. It has to be efficient and also incredibly complex (all modern emulators are HAL or API reimplementations by necessity). Those emulators you reference didn’t require commercial amount of funding because they were created by the time emulated hardware was obsolete. It was a nice balance where Nintendo didn’t sue anyone. That is until Yuzu/Citra folks decided to enrich themselves in the process, bring
SauronNintendo gaze and ruin things for everyone.I’m fairly certain that Ryujinx is a hobby project as well, which would contradict your claim that developing emulators for later-gen systems requires funding. However, I may be mistaken.
Regardless of if I am right about Ryujinx, your claim that I am “cheering for another company” just because I called a spade a spade with regards to Nintendo’s legal trickery in the Yuzu case is still wrong. As I said, the Yuzu team was wrong to profit off of adding patches for leaked games. They deserved to get their Patreon shut down for that. However, the sentence forbade them from ever working on a Nintendo emulator again, which is excessive because developing an emulator is not and should not be illegal.
For another example that might clarify my position: I believe that Palworld is in many ways a blatant rip-off of Pokémon IP that obviously marketed itself on its similarities with Nintendo’s franchise. Nintendo was quite right to sue them. However, the lawsuit evoked patents whose very existence is the epitome of bullshit, such as using a drawn outline to represent the position of a player character or NPC who is totally or partially obscured behind an opaque object. This is an obvious solution, and one of the requirements for a patent is that it be non-obvious.
We live in a complex world. It is possible to be in the right and still be an unethical overreaching asshole about it.
Ryujinx got caught in a crossfire. I’m pretty sure Nintendo wouldn’t dare to harass them, similar to Dolphin, if it wasn’t for all the publicity Yuzu was bringing to Switch piracy. Nintendo shouldn’t have done that but here we are and it’s Yuzu that started this by breaking unwritten rules and playing dumb.
Yuzu was a commercial enterprise. The moment you start taking money for this kind of work it’s no longer a hobby project and should bear all of the legal consequences. Yuzu guys were smart, they played a scrappy underdog but if your whole business idea hinges on breaking multiple laws for the purpose of making money (and they made much more than covering current expenses) you’re asking for trouble. They also enjoy a bit of a revenge from the grave with all the people angry over their toys being taken away doing black PR for Nintendo. Everyone is free to do as they please but what I’m seeing is just a hissy fit so there isn’t that much nuance to this.