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Since you’re being reasonable again, I’ll answer.
Perhaps “demanded” was the wrong word to use. It got the wrong point across. You did not explicitly ask for it, but rather strongly implied that you wanted the other guy’s argument to be a certain way. (your comment I am referring to is quoted below). Ultimately, you were right, as the plot has thickened over the past 2 hours. In another comment the other guy agreed with the explanation I provided, and used that to claim that proc gen and gen ai are effectively the same (a claim that I disputed in another another comment). So on this point, you win. It was I who misunderstood the other guy’s argument.
I feel like it does. theunknownmuncher thinks it’s somehow inconsistent to be against generative AI while being ok with procedural generation, which implies that they think they’re equivalent in some way. As if the reason people don’t like generative AI is because it makes bad games.
Point not proven.
There are many reasons why people in general actively dislike generative ai. Many of those reasons have to do with the creation of the ai (including environmental damage and harm to artists, and more besides), and are applicable regardless of the quality of the end product.
Furthermore, using generative ai does tend to make the end product worse, regardless of what that product is. This does not mean that it is impossible to make good shit with ai, nor does it mean that ai only makes good shit. There’s nuance to the issue that is often ignored.
Furthermore again, there is bandwagonning happening in the hate of ai. However, just begause bandwagonning is a logical fallacy, does not automatically make the arguments wrong (see the fallacy fallacy).
Furthermore the third, developers absolutely can be held at fault for using generative ai. Valve demands ai use be disclosed, they didn’t comply, ipso facto, devs are at fault. However, not all fault is equal. The example being discussed in the original post is much less egregious than most in my opinion. It’s not like they ai generated the entire game asset by asset.
I had another point but already forgot what it was so I’ll leave it at that for now.
You must be young. proc gen used to get tons of hate in the 2010 and such era, gamers complained about devs being lazy and not being willing to actually make levels/worlds/dungeons/whatever. This complaint was of course inconsistently applied.
These days people mostly just got used to it as normal. In 10 or 20 years, I’d wager the same will be true of gen ai.
different people like different things, sounds like your friends like rougish games.
I enjoyed bastion, it was probably my favorite game of its year. I don’t care enough about hades to even give it the time of day, no matter how hot they made zagreus. With few exceptions, I don’t really like rougish games. The few that I do like I’d rather they be long form rpgs so that I can have a build long enough to enjoy it for a while.
That said, studios should be allowed to make the games they want to make. Forcing them to do art against their will results in bad art.
Imma try to add something that hasn’t been mentioned in the top comments.
Epic’s refund policy is shit, comparable to nintendo. I buy a game, it doesn’t work, I don’t want to waste my time trying to figure out why, so I ask for refund, Epic said no. I’ve never had this problem at a physical retailer, and I’ve never had this problem with Steam.
This is the kind of shit that makes me want to pirate nintendo’s games purely for the principle of the matter.
I have several reasons for not buying nintendo’s games, from their piss-poor customer service, to threatening content creators with litigation, to actually litigating indie competitors, to cease-and-desisting fanmade mods and games, and generally treating their most dedicated fans like shit.
If it were possible to legally buy nintendo games and directly download them to my pc to play on whatever emulator I wanted, even if nintendo offered zero support for it, that might be enough to convince me to be a paying customer again. But no, nintendo has to do shit like this instead. fuck nintendo.
EDIT: I’d like to add on to the part about the cease and desisting of fanmade things, Nintendo likes to do that when they’re planning on announcing their own game that these fan projects would be competition for. Project M was killed shortly before Ultimate’s announcement. AM2R was killed shortly before nintendo’s own Metroid 2 remake was announced. Pokemon Uranium was killed shortly before, well, one of the pokemon games was announced, I couldn’t tell you which one since I stopped caring after gen 3. I’m sure there’s more that I don’t remember off the top of my head.
I was going through my own comment history, sorted by “controversial”, and found this. Wish I saw it at the time it was relevant, we could have had a conversation about this.
I stand by what I said, but I might not have said it very well.
There’s no reason why League of Legends could not have a “capture the flag” or “king of the hill” mode. There’s no reason why DOTA2 could not have a deathmatch mode. There’s no reason why Super Monday Night Combat couldn’t have any of these. And there’s no reason why Halo or Unreal or Call of Duty could not have a MOBA mode.
The fact that nobody has done it is not evidence that it cannot be done.
They could literally just copy steam, add their “we take less of a cut” thing, and be in a good place.
Instead, using their storefront sucks, their customer service sucks, they lack features you’d expect of a major platform, and they’re pretentious dicks about it. Instead of fixing these obvious problems, they’re bribing devs for exclusivity, pumping their marketing with bullshit, and litigating apple over their app store (actually that last one is kinda great). The epic store today would be competition to steam if steam was still as it was 20 years ago when everyone hated steam.
I’m talking about normies, not gamers, and not power users like yourself.
Normies touch their pc for less than one hour a day, because everything they could want is in their phone. Many normies don’t even have internet connections in their home because they exclusively engage with the internet through their phone. I’ve talked to normies who don’t have pcs at all because their ipads do everything they could possibly want.
It’s a fact that there are certain games that simply do not run on linux, because of drm or developer stupidity or any number of reasons. As a separate argument, I’d argue that those games are not worth playing. I used to be a hardcore gamer, I’ve gotten old since then and become a casual. I don’t have time nor energy to dedicate to figuring out why game x won’t run on pc y with configuration z. If the big green play button doesn’t work, I refund the damn thing, and in my almost 2 years of linux usage I have yet to need to do that. Another separate argument is my disdain for AAA games, the lack of ethics in their creation, and the abysmal conditions in which they always launch in these days.
So as to your actual question, can I convince you to switch your gaming pc to linux? No, and I’m not even going to try. If you insist on playing the latest AAA slop that the megacorps shovel at you, then you must have windows and you must continue to allow microsoft to continue to rape your digital existence in order to have crappy entertainment that I wouldn’t dignify with the time of day.
I switched to linux full time almost a year ago.
I have been thus far entirely unsuccessful in convincing anyone else to make the jump. Normal people do not give a fuck, will not lift a finger to improve their digital lives. I’ve been telling friends and family about adblockers for YEARS, and not a single one ever bothered to do it of their own volition. If I don’t do it for them, then they just sit through ads like complacent sheep. None of them are going to change operating systems if they can’t even install a browser extension.
i know it’s not the important part of your comment, but I must point out that indies will be fine because indies do not have publishing deals. If your studio is beholden to a publisher, then you are by definition not independent.