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That’s true in most European countries nowadays. You can use sms authentication but it usually cost extra.
And that still doesn’t solve the government app issue, o have all my ID loaded and get all my government notification on that, including tax deadlines, official communication and official IDs… That would be a serious step back if I am forced to give it up
I agree with most of everything you wrote.
But banking apps and government apps is not a convenience, is a requirement, especially because, well, by law, they are required to provide an app and there is no choice around it. At least here.
I could indeed go back to bicycle everywhere I want to go and take in the train, but that is not convenience, that is life, so I need a car.
My point is that Google controls Android, whether they graciously allow us to have our foss Android and recompile it from sources is nice, but we still depend on Google and this is not good.
This is what needs to change, and there is no way around it.
I beg to defer on the device drivers. Maybe you don’t remember, but it’s been decades before Linux would adapt, reimplement or convince manufacturer to provide drivers for it.
Modems first. Graphics card next. Wi-Fi networks also. Winprinters. They all come to my mind. And it’s only by time and effort that now looks just works everywhere.
And now while graphene indeed is doing a great job that I appreciate very much, at the same time they are not developing an operating system. Google is.
There is a huge effort behind developing a full operating system, and it also requires standardization and somebody who defines what the standards are.
At this point, Google is the only one doing that. And if they go closed doors, no open source AOSP clone could keep up with Google changing standards and still be compatible, which would end up as an incompatible operating system.
My point is that currently Android needs Google, and there is no fooling around. We are years away of being independent from Google, whatever the great effort other developers are doing.
I appreciate everybody’s work and I have been a lineage supporter and maintainer myself.
There are tons of issues that we need to solve to be really independent from Google. Forking he’s the least of those.
I am sorry to say that forking AOSP is not an easy solution.
I cannot talk for Grafene as I don’t know much of that organization, but I have been part of the Lineage Os organization for a little bit as a maintainer, and I can tell you that nobody is actually able to start working on such an effort as an AOSP fork.
I would gladly be happy if such a work would actually be maintained and supported long time, but I’m skeptical that anybody but a big organization has a power and a resource is to do so. After all even Linux is actually brought along by lots of organizations and also commercial organizations.
Yes, we need an open source trust platform, and I believe that is the only real way forward. I would vouch for a Linux mobile operating system, but indeed, air truly open, Android would be good as well.
You talk of what you don’t know. Bank apps here are mandatory by law. If you don’t or can’t use a bank app then you can use a SMS verification approach where you are required to PAY SMS that the bank sends you.
Receiving SMS here is free, only those from the bank for verification are to be paid without the bank app, it’s just a scam to force you to use the bank app.
The bank app itself is not a scam like a you are the service approach, and it’s not free either as you pay the bank services with your bank account fees already. Maybe you don’t pay a specific fee for the app, bit you already pay your home banking fees anyway.
While play services are mandatory for play cartification, the opposite is not automatic. In fact, bootloader and device fingerprint play an important role and when you replace the stock OS usually play integrity fails by design.
Do you know first hand that you can achieve play integrity with Graphene and no strange tricks like spoof signature or root?
I don’t care for cardless payments, but I do use internet banking, you cannot do without at least here, and government apps too are useful and doing with out is just… Impossible.
Mobile banking is mandatory here, if not able to do mobile banking then you can use non free SMS messages, which sucks.
Government apps mandatory I mean that without, you are cut from most digital government services, which is not practical at all. Survivable, but a pain.
People don’t get it: it doesn’t matter Graphene or LineageOS. Its still Android and will still be bound to the same limitations, unless you go fully degoogled which means give up on internet banking, cardless payments and government apps. (And much more like m Donalds app and more… But I don’t care for those)
We need open trust platform not one controlled by Google, Graphene or lineage are just not valid alternatives. We need a Linux phone.
Both graphene and LineageOS are, o am afraid, still Android and still very much bound to what Google does of AOSP.
No AOSP means also no graphene and no LineageOS. They don’t develop an OS, they adapt and fix what Google does. They don’t have the resources or manpower to keep developing android without Google effort.
So if Google really locks android up, those are NOT valid alternatives. Also, even today those without Google Apps and play integrity certification means you cannot use many banking apps, government issued apps, McDonald app (joking, but true) and so on.
The future is even bleaker than what you are envisioning. A real Linux phone is the only answer and we are far from there.
After a long research to replace my old phone, I landed a Nothing Phone 3a. Last July bought for some 200€ and been happy ever since.
Plain android, not bloated, able to uninstall all crap and bootloader is not blocked and can be unlocked without phoning home.
Not related to the company at all, just an happy customer.
Main defects, lacks 3.5mm jack and not small at all.
Disclaimer: I have been a maintainer for LineageOS and a long time user.
Whoever advocates for LineageOS don’t get it. Using LineageOS will not fix any issue like this.
Already today using LineageOS means give up on banking apps, ID apps, and even McDonald’s and some games like Pokemon.
Yeah because Google with play intergrity now demands valid keys that gets invalidated as soon Google detect they are used for such usage. The cat and mouse game suddenly got much harder to beat.
So no, using LineageOS will soon be possible only with secondary devices and not your primary that you will need for your actual stuff to work.
I keep writing about Nothing Phones because I got one two months ago (3a) and I am very happy on how lightweight the stock OS is, very similar to the AOSP experience, and the bootloader is unlockable without even asking for permission.
Lineage usually is also supported, but currently not yet on the 3a.
It’s a bit bulky.
Samsung software got so much annoying and overblotaed that I despise it.
Also many stupid design choices…
Honestly nowdays Samsung flavour of android feels a lot like Xiaomi MIUI without the ads.
Go for pixel.
Or checkout Nothing phones… London based company, very lightweight software, and fully unlockable bootloader.
I got a 3A for a very reasonable price and loving it.
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I think it’s an issue with rooted or bootloader unlocked phones mostly …